#2116 The Drama Queen Gets Robbed - Patrick Bonello

0:00I get a team at CU project. Of course, it is Patrick's here, Tiff's here. I'm here. Hope you're well, hope you're enjoying the CU project. And if you're not part of our little online group Aruni, the CU project Facebook group is available for you. Is that what it's called the CU project podcast or I don't know. Yes, it's something of that group. I should probably know. But there's about 4,000 of us that jump on there and talk and young Danny, this week had something to celebrate in the group. We all did that like a little online community where people just support each other in all the good things. So if you're not part of that, there's no hooks, catches, or agendas. You just jump in and chat or jump out whatever the case. Hi, Patrick. Hey, how you doing? Are you part of the group? Uh, kind of, yes and no. Yes, I join you. Are you a member of the group? I think so. Yeah. But I don't monitor social media anymore, remember? I don't jump. Ah, that's true. Yeah, that's true. That's probably for the

1:03best. After talking to David Gillespie the other day, I was a bit depressed, but also a little bit enlightened. Uh, so I'm right now curating my relationship with social media and all of my attention regarding all things electronic. Uh, hi, Tiff. Hi, hampz. How are you? I'm fabulous. Friday morning. Now, Patrick and I saw that some male was in the background before we went live. Uh, I'm not sure that either he or I have given any kind of approval for that. Especially being an elderly at the morning to walk the dog. Yes. And it wasn't that what he does. Oh, sorry. I thought it was a letter from Australia post that you're right, Michelle. Yeah. So he's like a dog walker man. Is he? Yes. Yes. Yeah. Why was he in pajamas and like pajamas? I mean, jocks. Why? Why was the dog walker man pretty nude in the background? What was that about? I don't know. Giggling. Giggling like a fucking guilty schoolgirl. And Patrick's like, I wish I had

2:10one of them in my background. I was just going to say that I, um, I couldn't say, I don't, you must have x-ray glasses because you look pretty close to me. Oh, we're just, we're just fucking around for the show. Patrick, are you familiar with entertainment? No, you're familiar with that. No, but thanks for that. You're really added to what was going on. We don't let the truth get in the way of a good story, Patrick. Yeah, just let that, just let that roll. Now, Patrick, you've been the victim of a vicious crime up there in the place where you once bragged about how safe and beautiful it was. You don't lock your car. You don't lock your house, but you do now, don't you? No, well, I do lock my car, but it, um, it was parked across the road on one of those really hot days under a tree because there was no shade. And I left it overnight and someone broke into it. Yeah, smashed the windows. It wasn't fun, but I had my backpack in it, which is what I take to Tai Chi with all my notes and fans and a little bit of equipment and yes,

3:12my wallet. I know, I know everyone's been telling me how dumb I am and one friend in particular, hi, Sylvia, it constantly tells me how dumb I am. So thanks for that. But yeah, um, the police were really lovely. The forensic guys were really good, but the, the crimes or crime, I don't know if it was more than one person were wearing gloves. So they couldn't take any prints, but, but digital tracking. Thank you. Um, they used my credit card at nine different locations as they drove back to Melbourne. So I'm just wow, Melbourne. Yeah. Um, and the good thing is, please have CCTV footage. So I'm hoping that my stupidity may actually lead to a conviction. So in some ways, it's a good thing. Um, will you be locking it, moving forward all the time? I always lock it, no, no, I always lock it, but I just didn't have it in the driveway where I normally have it nice and safe where the camera is. And it was at a range of the camera. So yeah, it's not a good feeling is that when you'd walk up to your car or yet, like I've had a few things happen over the years,

4:15where you go, yeah, you come to a door at your house and like, I didn't leave that open or whatever, makes you feel sick in the guards. I don't know if you remember. I lived, um, I was renting a place in Turak, which again is supposedly a nice area. And, um, I had my camera in the glove box, but this is before they had screens on the back of them. It was a codec digital camera, one of the very first ones. And it got one. And anyway, I thought, uh, maybe I'll just check out a few of the pawn shops to see a few, you know, a few weeks later. Anyway, when I walked out of Club X, I'm sorry, I mean, the places that you can lock your wares, not wear your hawks, um, you know, along a long, a long, cheerful street, but all those places. I'm not helping you out. You dug this fucking hole. I saw it coming from two acres away. Anyway, I went to one of it. Fortunately, Tiff is the best crowd in the world. And you are lucky.

5:16When I do stand up, Tiff, you are so going to be there right at the front of everybody. Thank you. Anyway, so I walk in and I see this camera that's identical to my camera on sale. And I asked the guy, you know, is, uh, can I check out the camera? I said, if you've got the box and cables for it, no, mate, just as is. So I looked at it and the memory card was full. And I knew that my memory card in my camera had been full. And then I opened up the back of it and they had Panasonic batteries. And Panasonic batteries aren't that common in a lot of devices. You know, you tend to get Jerusalem ever ready. So I thought, I reckon this is my camera. So I went to the local police station and the desk sergeant, a person at the desk said, no, we can't do anything. You know, there's not much we can do. But, uh, C.I.B. Detective happened to be walking past and he turned to me and said, oh, what happened to your camera? And I told him the whole story. He said, right, let's jump in the car and go and have a look. Here's a lovely guy. And we're driving there. He says, yeah, there's bloody licensed thieves. So anyway, the short story is I took the camera, we got the camera,

6:21took it back to my place. And I had the box and packaging for it serial codes matched. So I knew it was my camera. I had to buy it back. Oh my god. I had to buy it back for the price that the pawn shop had purchased it for because even though I could prove it was my camera, they had ID, stolen ID, that that had been used to verify the person's sale. But anyway, so it's just, I know it's been a long-winded story. Apologies for that. But you're right, Craig. You do feel somewhat violent when something gets stolen that doesn't belong to you. It's not a competition, but I'll share one with you. That was a good one. Um, I bought it when I had harpers on the highway that he used to train at when TIFF was just, you know, doing year 12. I couldn't squeeze in as it's and trying to figure out what she wanted to do in the next. She'll do in that. Then decade or two. So I bought a new motorbike Patrick, which I was called a Suzuki 1100R, which was one of the first

7:22of the super bikes in that kind of, it looked like something you would ride on the track, but on the street, right? Early days of those super bikes. And back then, it's probably 25 years ago or something, cost me like 23 or 4 grand, which was a fortune, probably like 50 grand now. Anyway, blue and white, beautiful, amazing. Went out, I won't say where I bought it, but anyway, went out to this place, which is not near my house. It's the only place in Victoria I could get one. They'd just been released, bought it. Um, and while I was there, I bought this like fucking, I don't know what it was, titanium chain or something that you can't cut through. And just so I could lock, apart from the steering lock on the bike, I could also lock it so nobody could pinch it, blah, blah, blah. And I was, uh, I had to go back to the next day to pick it up. So anyway, I went back to the next day because that's pre-delivered all that. I picked it up, friend of mine dropped me off

8:23road at home, bibi, bobby, boo, still hadn't seen one on the road. Um, so I was super proud of myself next day. I was going to work driving and I saw, uh, opposite me on, at an intersection. In fact, um, nape and highway south road opposite me going the opposite direction of me, of course. I go, oh my god, there's my bike. Little did I know it was actually my fucking bike. Right? And I'm like, look at that dude. And it's the same. And it's, you know, obviously I had memorized the number plate, but I didn't even think. And then later that day I got home and clearly mine was gone. So I actually saw the guy vlogging my riding away on my bike. And I'm thinking what a gun he is because he's got a bike like me. Exactly. And, um, and then, and but the dumb thing that I did was, so you buy it from, and of course most dealers and not like this, but you buy it from the dealer and you pick it up tomorrow. So they can cut a key to the bike. They can cut a key to the padlock.

9:26All the bits and pieces I bought for security, they can replicate in the day between when you sign on the dotted and when you get it. So the guy who stole it at the very least worked for the dealership or worked for the dealership or knew someone who did. So he just came to my joint, which he also had the address because I signed all the paper, drove to my joint or dropped, got dropped off, had all the keys, unlocked everything, just rode it away. And you're like, oh, and then, which is understandable, but then I got interrogated for about four hours by the fucking insurance company like I was a criminal and I had done this. So yeah, I sympathize with you. Wow. Yeah, that's, that's pretty full, isn't it? Oh, yeah, it's ridiculous. It's ridiculous. All right. What are we, uh, what are we tacking today? What is there anything that takes your fancy or do you just want me to throw a creepy art? Creepy art story. And this is one of the most

10:31bizarre things. It doesn't surprise me in the slightest meta basically had patented. It's come out that they painted a AI that would continue to post for you when you die. Oh, yeah. Who wants, who wants that? Yeah. So now this happened in December and they weren't the first to do it. Microsoft actually had the same idea, but then shelved it saying, yeah, probably a bit creepy if we have a chatbot model. This was that in 2021, but they're saying now, no, no, no, we're not really going to use it. The idea had come out of, so say, for example, Krego on the TYP channel on, you know, on Facebook decides to go away on an extended holiday, you could effectively use this to post for you while you're on a break. And I think part of the idea and then someone thought, keep it, what if someone dies? It could keep posting for them. And so, and you know that if you can, if you could put all of your collected works into an AI,

11:38it would really be able to mimic your voice. So in a long one, you could effectively, and who knows it down the track podcasting, it could, you know, it could just be Tiff and I and an AI. Well, very well could be. I mean, the quality of the kind of AI podcast that are using, you know, celebrities voices apart sometimes from the cadence or the timing, but it's pretty indistinguishable. I mean, it is, but it's getting very close to being able to know. So I also see that some artists and writers, and I thought this would be the case, are quite hesitant to disclose when they're using AI or collaborating with AI because what, what do you think the reason is for that just embarrassment or fear of losing legitimacy or legitimacy? There's a perception out there. If you're an artist and you say, oh, yeah, by the way, I used AI to help get some themes for my new book, then the authenticity and the sense of creativity is diluted, I think, you know, yes.

12:43But interestingly, there was a little bit of a research study and what they did was they took two and a half thousand creative professionals and across four continents, and this was a study done in 2024, and they found that 85% of them were using AI in their work. Now, if you use AI, it's to help you get organised in the day, you help manage your emails, and then you jump into the creative process, even then the fact that AI is helping you was still a bit of a stigma for most people that the perception was that you were almost like cheating by using AI. I mean, I use it for concept work sometimes if I'm stuck on an idea, and then I think, well, yeah, maybe I'll just jump into AI. Sometimes it's awful. It's terrible. Other times you think, oh, yeah, that's not a bad idea. I think that at the end of the day, it's just like any tool. I'm sure, you know, people were saying this when computers came out, and you know, the fact that we were using these devices or adding

13:46machines, you know, calculators, rather than... Yeah. An advocate. And I think it's just about global acceptance that, you know, as it gets more and more integrated, I know that when I take a photograph, and I send people photographs, now I have an option to press a button, and it's nano-banana on my phone, and wow, I think the nano-banana button, I can change that photo before I send it. So I was sitting talking to some friends. We were in a walking group. We go walking together every Thursday morning. We've been doing it from at 15 or 16 years, and then we have a coffee afterwards. And I was excited to listen to a friend of mine. She was talking about using AI. And so I took a photo of the group of people sitting at the table, and I just, in the prompt, I said, turn this into a Christmas scene. Suddenly, there was a Christmas tree in the background, baubles and decorations on the table, and you know, the same people were there. One person was a little Christmas hat, and it just literally changed the, you know, what was there. But it makes me

14:50wonder too. The reality was so clear. It looked so real. I almost turned it around to the other people and said, hey, remember, this is funny. We were sitting in the same positions this time last year in December, you know, just to see if I could fool anybody, because not everybody was listening to the conversation. There were people in their own conversation, and you sit around with a group of people. Well, the reality is there is no reality. Are we being deceived? Well, yeah, maybe we are. And credibility, where does that work? I mean, you use AI all the time, Craig. I use it for different things, but it's interesting you say this, because like all of the stuff that I write on Instagram, if you don't follow me on Instagram, folks, that's fine. But if you want to just Craig, anything happen, but like I'll put up some things like I'm just looking at one post right now. I wanted to read you this for a reason. It just says it's handwritten on a whiteboard by me, 100% original. It's not brilliant, but of course, life's a shit show, and then it's awesome, and then you're sad and then happy, and then it's lunchtime. Your challenge is not to create a

15:54perfect life, but rather to thrive in the inevitable imperfection of it all. Now, I've posted that same post probably 15 times over the last few years, and the worst it ever gets is a million views. One time it got two and a half million views, right? So I thought, I'm going to take that. I took that and a few other higher rating ones, and I wrote, so these are posts that I put on Instagram, 100% original, written with my hand on a whiteboard, taken a photo of, tidied up a bit, you know, made a bit clearer and cleaner. I want you to come up with a post similar to this, or similar to these written in my style, bit of swearing, whatever, but original, they were fucking terrible. Like terrible, like nothing like, oh my god, you couldn't, you know, but if you want to go, hey, tell me a funny story about how the pyramids were built, well, it can crush that, right? Or you want to give me your thoughts on, like yesterday, I'll talk for a minute or two and then

16:58I'll shut up, but this is very relevant to you. Do you, have you opened the door at all on AI agents, like agentic AI? Yeah, a little bit, they just looked into it. Okay, so I just want to read this because this blew me away. So agentic AI refers to artificial intelligence systems that don't just respond to prompts, they take initiative, set goals, make decisions, and act autonomously to achieve an objective. In simple terms, traditional AI answers questions, agentic AI pursues outcomes, and this is happening now. The core idea, most current AI tools including chat assistance are reactive, you ask the answer. Agentic AI is goal oriented and self-directed. You give it an outcome that you want, it figures out the steps, it executes them, and it adapts if and when needed. Key features of agentic AI, goal oriented, works towards to find objectives,

18:03autonomous decision making, chooses actions without human input, planning ability, breaks large goals in smel, blah, blah. I'm like, this is just a person. This is a person, and I was listening to a guy yesterday who's the boss of Uber. His name is Darra Koshua Hari or something. But anyway, when he took over Uber, they were losing three billion a year. In 2017, they are now making 10 billion a year. And they're implementing all of these kind of, you know, these AI kind of agents to take positions. And they're employing other people. They're still one of the biggest employers in the world. But it's the shit that's happening. It's almost like you can't keep up. And yeah, because Melissa started telling me about she wants to build this team of agents. And I'm like, how can you, you're going to sacked if and I? What's going on?

19:04So there's a really lovely sense of authenticity to you riding your posts on a white board and taking a photo and putting it up there. But last year, I did a little, a little kind of project that I started to myself and I had a whiteboard marker in my bathroom and on the mirror every night before I went to bed after I brushed my teeth, I'd ride a high coup. So that's a Japanese poem. It's a 575 syllable. So one line of five syllables, one line of seven, one line of five. And it was really interesting pushing yourself to be creative. That end of the day, I'm always a bit tired. But I really set myself a goal to ride a high coup every single day. And it was such a fun challenge. And I started taking photos of them, which was kind of fun. You know, I'd have to go back and look for them. And I don't think they were earth shattering and I don't think I'm going to publish a book of high coup. But there was a study recently, a psychologist's now saying that people who write shopping lists, physically writing a shopping list rather than typing it into your phone,

20:09instead of that, they're actually using a cognitive processing and that actually strengthens your memory. It's also intention and presence. And that doesn't happen when you type it into a phone. So physically writing, forming the words, is helps with the intention and the intent and memorizing what it is on that list. So I thought that's interesting. And the fact of doing that. And I know we've laughed at me many times about the fact that I like to use a fountain pen. But I love writing still. And I adore writing. And I still like using technology. But that's, no, it's interesting, isn't it? I'm with you. I think it is like, there's a lot of mellow drama at the moment around around apps and around the use of AI and around the use of, you know, social media broadly. But I think that every individual needs to be, I had this chat with Gillespie and Tiff about, you know, just like really what is happening with these brains that are getting

21:10hijacked by this medium. And so literally, you, it takes your attention. You're not choosing what to focus on. It's choosing for you. And so now you are just a passenger. You're not driving the bus like it has your attention, not the other way around. So it's like, I thought about it. And definitely I've got an issue. Definitely. And I have to change it because it's my brain is my most important tool. And if anything that's going to kind of impact my ability to think clearly focus, create resolve problems, you know, like use my brain well and keep my brain healthy. To me, it's almost like I'm doing all this training, then coming home and eating donuts and pizza. That's the, that's the analogy for me. Like I do all of this work with my brain. And then I just fucking unplugged my brain and let this thing hijack my prefrontal cortex. So I'm offline and it's online. And it's, I fucking hate it. I've got to stop it.

22:13I got a really interesting email during the week from one of our listeners, Dale Lizzie's name, Dale Patterson. And it was a blog article that he sent through to me about AI Slop. And it's a guy by the name of Guwinder. He's Handler's Guwinder. And it's a blog called The Prism. And what he did was he took a whole lot of phrases and he just kind of paraphrased each of the key terms. So one of them was the 1% rule. So in online communities, 1% of users produce almost all of the content. Yeah. The 99 consumers, the one person in writing my content. And then he talked about Slopper Gander. More online articles are now written by AI than humans. So if you look at an article, there's a good chance that it's going to be an AI written article, not a human one. Yeah. Mollack Spagen. This is when large learning models, so AI's compete for votes on social media. So they push lies and rage bait to actually win. So it's not about

23:16it's trying to get that engagement and to get the most posts possible or the most likes possible. So that doesn't matter. There's no filter to say this is actually really crap. It's just about getting that algorithm right. But this is the one that made me think of what you were just talking about before and switching off. I love the paradox of boredom. Yeah. We walk around with the most powerful super computers that you can imagine in our pocket. And the reality of that means the second that you get bored, and I do this all the time, I swipe, I jump on, I look at, and for me, it's reading articles or whatever it happens to be looking at YouTube reels. But the reality of it is we don't get bored anymore because we've always got something there to keep us entertained. And boredom is what fuels creativity, not having technology. So because our brains are constantly looking for that excitement, it's there all the time. But if we take that away, if we say to ourselves, okay, I'm going to go cold turkey on this, I'm going to go, can you imagine going away for a weekend

24:20and not taking your phone? Yeah. I could feature going for a hike or a walk. Yeah. But if I'm being honest, would that scare me a little bit, it would, which is probably why the fuck I should do it. I think, I think we bullshit ourselves. I think most people that I know, I don't think you're one, I'm not tiff would have to decide for yourself. But most people that I know, including me, actually have a little bit of a problem. I'm not saying it's life destroying, but I'm like, I definitely have something that I need to put on my big boy pants and go, yeah, I waste time. And I do the thing that I tell people not to do. And I don't even, I kind of choose it. But I, you know, the story is always, I'm just going to see what's happening with this. And then 40 minutes later, I'm like, I don't even know what started me, but here I am 40 minutes later. And I've just wasted 40 minutes of energy and back in time, productivity, you know, so.

25:21I don't know what I should bring up this next topic because I know that you're going to ridicule me. And I was watching a documentary recently on a new term in the community online called Gooning. Do you know what Gooning is? Do either of you know what Gooning is? I do not carry on. I feel like the person. Why do you, why do you do this if you know it's going to not produce a good response? No, no, it's what's your agenda? What's your reason? I have no agenda. I'm trying to educate the masses to, well, masses. Oh, I can look at you. Jesus trying to educate the masses to masses to baiting. No, okay, because, okay, so Gooning is a term that's used to prolong the sexual build-up. Wow. Right. So. Well, there's only one of us, well, one, two of us on this goal for whom that is relevant. Well, yeah, anyway, it could be one. I do the same thing with food. I just walk around

26:23it for half an hour and think about it. No, but the frightening thing about this this documentary that I saw is that people can engage in this by just looking at pornography. They have multiple screens, projectors, and all they do is they spend a whole lot of time. We're talking hours, eight hours, nine hours, ten hours, just looking at pornography. And there's a whole online communities that are now dedicated to this. So once by the time, it was kind of embarrassing. Oh, you know, I kind of that person did whatever. But now it's become a whole thing. But talk about throwing your life away. Like, I mean, I couldn't imagine spending a whole day like, yeah, anyway. But I find that sad because that 100%. Nobody's doing that who's not an addict. Yeah. Nobody's doing that for any logical, healthy reason. And I mean, all of those people are addicted. It could be anything else. But it's like, yeah, I don't know. That stuff. It's like, yeah. And then well, artificial intimacy. And I'm kind of jumping off that topic. But on that same

27:28list that I was talking about the blog, you know, I had a young guy who was sharing a long story. Anyway, he lived with me for three years, got kicked out of home. He and his girlfriend were sitting on the couch ones. And they were, they were, they were comparing how many friends they had on their on their Facebook. And I thought, yeah, they're not your friends. You know, this artificial intimacy. You know, no one on your Facebook list, if you've got a thousand Facebook friends, no, they're not your friends. But do you know what is interesting? One, you're correct. Two, from a psychological, sociological and experiential perspective, this is what I think. Let's say somebody's got an AI friend. And the net result of their AI friend is positive. I'm not saying that's always a case of course it isn't. But somebody who lives in rural wherever they live 10 miles from the next house, they're a bit disconnected. Maybe they've got a few personal challenges. But every day they get

28:32up and they talk to this friend. And for them, they feel better. They feel, you know, and obviously it's not a real human. And obviously the, the emotions, the other way anyway are not real. But for the person, those emotions and feelings might be real, which means the net result, the experience is good. Which is not say I think everyone should be doing that. But I think this area of the, the impact of relationships with different forms of technology, I think that's going to become more and more of a thing because I think people are going to, more and more people are going to have for one to the more accurate term relationships with virtual entities. I want one. I can't wait. I cannot wait. And I think we talked about it on the last podcast. I want an AI assistant. You know, in the Iron Man films, I mean, that's different. And AI assistant is not, not an emotional relationship. But if you're talking about intimacy, but now I'm thinking,

29:36like in your case, you've got Melissa, I'm thinking that where you've got someone you can talk to, you can kind of say, well, what's happening today? What's up? You know, have a full on conversation. I know what you're saying, but I think that eventually the more you rely on that, the, I mean, in the, I know I'm talking about a movie here, but we all felt kind of, you know, warm about Jarvis, the AI that Tony Stark uses. I thought, I want him to be my friend too. So I think even though we know it's an AI, even though we know it's a chat bottle, whatever, that that would be impossible not to form at some sort of connection, some sort of fondness for that, that entity that is with you every day. If you wake up, not chatting, and what am I doing today? How can I better do this? Because we start to rely on it. And that, that, you know, crutch that we start to use, it can be beneficial. It'll be fantastic. Don't forget to do this. Don't forget to do that, you know, you know, we've got this coming up. I think that we would eventually form a relationship of sorts with whatever AI chatbot we're using.

30:38And put up your hand if you've ever been in an unhealthy human relationship. Everyone in the fucking world, you know, yes, tips, tips, tips ready. Yeah, I was thinking about the impact, the long term impact of just another area in our life where we are essentially avoiding discomfort because I think about the conversations I've had on friendships and relationships where rupture and repair is what creates depth and intimacy. And yet then somebody chooses this AI version of friendship, which gives them all the field goods, but it's another area that we always have in every other area of life where we don't have to get uncomfortable. And in future, then we avoid it more and more. And what little connection we already had with real people will have less of because it's too hard. I'm not willing to get uncomfortable. I'm not willing to express needs or show up for the other person because in this relationship with AI, it's all about me. It's one-sided. Yeah, that's so interesting. If I actually really like that point, I've often talked, you know,

31:40I've got a really close friends that have very differing political views. I mean, extremist political views, you know, they think veganism is a wank. They like Donald Trump. You know, they, yeah, it's quite funny. And, and, but I like them a lot. They're really lovely people. They're great friends. And if I had an AI chat pot, it would just agree with everything that I said. I love what you just said, Tiff. It's, it's so true. And I love the challenges. I love the diversity of people in my life. I like people to argue with me. Tell me I'm wrong. You know, nag me for leaving my wallet in the car. But the reality of it is, yeah, who wants to hold what a yesman around? You just kind of there telling you that you're great all the time. And how good is it when you've got a friend and they haven't had time and you get to show up for them? Well, AI's not going to do that. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. You make valor points. I think I hear what you're both saying. I think

32:42it's a little bit situation and context dependent. You know, I think a lot of people don't have anyone that gives a fuck about them, like really, really, really loves them and really cares. And there are a lot of people who are deeply, deeply sad and disconnected and alone. And I don't for any minute think that AI is the answer to that. Just like I don't think one person is the answer for any, do you know what I mean? I think the answer is us trying to figure out ourselves and to understand our own mind and our own emotions and our own behaviors and our own subjective experience of life and to work through that. But I think it's like it's for some people that's going to be a positive addition to their life. And for some people, it's going to lead to some unhealthy toxic devastating bloody relationship or pseudo relationship. But just like, you know, you've got someone in your life now and from the outside looking into if it seems to me overwhelmingly positive, you know, but then you've also had other humans in your life where that

33:46was the opposite. And the same with me, it's like I don't think because, you know, we build this connection rapport and trust and love, which is great. But as we know, that doesn't always work out over the long term. So, but you're right in that, you know, being able to have hard relationships and to be reflective and to be able to kind of figure out what is going on with me really and what is going on with me in relation to other people. But I think nonetheless that moving forward, there will be, you know, in a decade, the prevalence of these kinds of relationships, I think is going to be high, high. Patrick, let's digress a little bit because I saw this on Telly or somewhere I saw this about this dude who was trying to hack his robot. He's a programmer. And he hacked his bloody vacuum, his robot vacuum because he wanted to use it with his game console and he ended

34:50up hacking 6,700 vacuums around America. And he could see into all these, like he could literally had video into all of these homes in real time of what people were doing. That's fucking terrifying. So DJI is the company that makes the amazing drones that are very popular around the world. I think I've exclusively had DJI drones. I still fly them. But they released the DJI romo robot vacuum cleaner recently. And so this guy who was a bit of a security expert and decided he wanted to use his joystick control or his, you know, his game control, I think it was the Xbox controller or to control the vacuum, thought it'd be a bit fun. And then realized getting into the base code that because they talked back to the base station and they learned because the idea of these robot vacuums is they look at the world around them, they map the area and then they use that to be able to effective clean better. But yeah, this is amazing. So he didn't need a security pin or

35:55anything because he already had an account. He was able to log in and get access to other vacuum cleaners. And the scary thing is that they have light hour sensors that can sense the object around them. They'd bank maps of the house and they also have cameras. It's a frightening thought that someone could then literally use your own device against you to just spy on you, to map out your house, to look at what you've got. And it's crazy. As I understand it, correct me if I'm wrong, but yet one that is fucking terrifying. But the dude who did that obviously did it accidentally. Then he went to whoever he needed to go to and went, hey, guess what? I did this accidentally and kind of put up his hand so that he wouldn't be charged with any kind of, I'm sure that's a crime if he was doing it intentionally. But so I think he I think he just demonstrated to them that their system or their tech was relatively hackable and flawed. Yeah. There are a lot of white, they call them white hackers out there that actually

36:55support the industry. They look for vulnerabilities. Google has a competition that it runs to try to get people to find vulnerabilities in its systems and then it gives them, it rewards them. So yeah, there are a lot of really good programmers out there who are altruistic and in some cases get rewarded for that. But I thought this was interesting. Oh, and the other thing is, well, I didn't realize that robot vacuum cleaners have microphones in them as well. The ultimate spied device. Why would they need that? I don't know. I'm not sure. Yeah. I don't know. Maybe you can talk to them. Krego. It's like, hey, little fella, come over here. Hey, R2. It's pretty lonely at my joint. So they're launching a timber. Yeah. Wooden satellite that surely that seems inconsistent with going into space like shit burning up. No, no, quite the opposite. In fact, it's in shit burning up is exactly right. So you're kind of right and wrong. There was a bit of work done on the International Space Station and I think we chatted about this

37:56maybe two years ago where they were testing different sorts of wood to see what their resilience was like in space. Space debris and the chemicals that are released into the atmosphere when a lot of satellites burn up in the atmosphere, aluminium, that sort of stuff are actually quite toxic chemicals. And so a Japanese company has been doing a lot of research into the concept of encasing the satellite in wood. And it looks like that the ligno sat is the first wooden satellite that's going to be sent into space. And the reason that it's going to be great is because one of it eventually expires. It's used by date when it burns up in the atmosphere. It's just wood and it's not going to release. I mean, it's still going to have obviously electronics inside it. They're not carving up transistors like hand-carving transistors, but the bulk of the satellite, the exterior part. And it's quite durable. The interesting thing that came out of this research on the International Space Station is when you take wood into space, there's no bacteria and

39:00there's no moisture. The things that normally will cause wood to rot. So when you think about it, it's the perfect material to go out into space because it's going to be fairly resilient. And that's what came up during this research study. And now the practical example is it looks like they're going to fire off this, not fire off. They're going to put it on board, a launch satellite, a launch rocket and wooden satellites. It'd be great. Based on your no-bacteria and no, what was the other thing you said? Because it's cold. So the water won't be rotting because bacteria is in water, I guess. No, no. You said in space, there's like what causes the wood to rot normally is not up there. Yeah, that's right. So bacteria and water. So I'm wondering if old mate was in space at the space station and someone died and you just pushed him out the door. Would he just be held in state, perpetually kind of in space environment? And then you could go grab him a couple of decades later when we figured out how to

40:05kind of restart the bit, the broke and just pull him back on board. And he's like, fuck, that was a good sleep. Yeah, you've been sleeping for 25 years, bro. The ultimate cryogenics, yeah, that's right. Hey, one battery swap, we're talking about cars. I don't even know how would you do, I must be done by a machine. A battery swap, I'll swap. Obviously, we're talking about EVs in less than 0.5 seconds. Neo sets new record for four consecutive days. So that is battery life in EVs and the technology around that is changing pretty quickly. So yeah, there's two aspects to that. So obviously, the duration it takes to charge a battery has been a bit of a push back in the market because people don't want to wait all that time. So in China, Neo has, they do, I think, they've up over 175,000 battery swaps since they were set up. And that's an amazing amount. So

41:06they basically have a concept whereby if you buy this car, there are all these service stations that are around China that you can go to where you do a swap and go. So you don't charge the battery, they have a stock supply of ready charged batteries and they swap and go. And it's the swap stations are now getting more batteries, they're getting faster the technology because it used to take a while, it used to take five minutes, four to five minutes for the battery to be taken out and then swapped. But now it's a lot more efficient, they've got a lot better with it. And I know we spoke about this with the motorcycle manufacturers, the top, I think top three motorcycle manufacturers, but they just, electric cycles haven't taken on very much. The EV bikes have, and they're ridiculously fast and legislations trying to catch up with that. The latest on that is that, I know I'm digressing, but the latest on the EV bikes thing is that they want to actually classify them as motor bikes and make people have bikes like bike licenses to be able to. Well, they are, they are essentially a lot of them. But I think the thing that non-motor bike people don't really get about motor bikes and

42:14Tiff can speak to this is, who the fuck wants to ride something that's silent? Like for me, it's about, it's about the visceral, the vibration, it's about the noise, it's about the throttle response, like and also one of the reasons people love EVs is because they're much faster than fuelcars or internal combustion engines, right? But that's not the case with motorbikes. Like motorbikes are faster than you need. So yeah, but nonetheless, I think they will take off and they are building, but I think it's going to be a slower uptake because most motorcycles ride them because they love motorbikes, whereas a lot of people drive because they've got to get from A to B. Yeah, no, it's a good point. I was fascinated to see that earlier this month, that company NIO with the swap over batteries, they did the 100 million battery swap, 100 million battery swap.

43:15That's crazy. That's crazy. I don't know if you know, but so like you go to a server, you put in your petrol, you pay at 80 bucks or whatever you pay. So with this, you go and you get your battery swapped over and there's a set, like obviously, that's not for zero, so they must have to go and pay a set for you every time that happens. Yeah, I don't know. I'm not entirely sure how that works or what the charge would be. Yeah, but for the convenience, that'd be awesome, wouldn't it? Yeah, Tim, would you drive an EV as in a car? Have you thought about, I mean, your cars, it's not that it's all, but it's, what is your car for five years? Oh, mine's a 2018. So yeah, it's good. So that's 80 years old. Would your next car, what are the percentage chances of your next car being an EV? I mean, I'm not that far. I'm not a real car person. So I don't like the driving experience. I just find them, they, when they take off in front of me or I hear them, they still freak me out, I find them weird, especially EV buses.

44:19Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's not that churning, polluted diesel smell. You know, if you're sitting behind on a bike, that'd be awesome. Um, sitting behind an electric car. That's very valid, very valid point, Patrick. I have nearly died of carbon, fucking monoxide poisoning a thousand times sitting behind, fucking buses and trucks that are just spewing out toxic shit into my face. That's not, that's, that's not the attractive part of, it's on the open road, the fresh here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The interesting point to that is that I think with the EV market, my wish for that would be totally autonomous EV. So I'm not talking about going for the weekend drive. I'm thinking the commute because if you put, if you put AI in charge of EV on the road during the commute, during the, the peak hour, I guarantee you, peak hour won't be as bad as what it is now. Take the heat. Yes. Can I, of course, human error out of it? And that's where I see

45:23it would be really good for the daily commute. So people can be working at, you know, in their cars, listening to an audio book, not having to worry about that. No accidents on the roads or less accidents on the road. So I think that's where the combination of EV and AI together would be great. But when I had my car windows smashed last week, I got a courtesy car through my insurance company and it was the Toyota Corolla hybrid. And I've got to tell you, 4.8 liters per 100 kilometers. So it ran off the smell of an oily rag. But because it's a pretty, the Toyota have been doing hybrids for a long time, there is a battery button where if you stay below 40 kilometers an hour, I could drive to the supermarket, nanostyle, and not use any petrol at all. And that was playing with battery a lot when I was driving the car, sticking under 40. They were pioneers with the Prius, which was, I don't know, 35 years ago. And that was 100% EV back then. And we're all like,

46:27that's fucking, that's never going to take off. But yeah, I, yeah, yeah, what's going to say to you? It's something on the tip of my tongue. Oh, that's right. That guy, Dara, from Uber. He, they were talking about, this was on Diary of a CEO, Steven Bartlett. They were talking about the reality that autonomous vehicles, EVs are going to overtake, or going to play a very big role in the Uber space and the like moving forward. And he said, like what are they talking about? What are the potential hurdles with people getting in a car with no driver? And it's all really psychological and emotional. And I would have to look at the research, but what he said is that it's about 10 times safer. So autonomous vehicles are about 10 times safer than humans driven by vehicles. And they've got lots and lots and lots of data. It's just that the idea still freaks people out. So I would gladly get in an autonomous vehicle. I would gladly.

47:34I could think nothing better than just sitting back, just doing whatever or having a snooze. You love driving, though, don't you? I enjoy driving. And I've got to tell you, I was devastated when the car got broken into because I love my car. I've actually, because I, I've never had a new car before. I always bought secondhand cars. And the previous car I had was probably one of the ugliest cars on the market during my Renault scenic McGahn. It was just. Oh, no, you've had a couple of ugly cars that fucking Nissan that that burgundy Nissanette. That was a ugly mother fucker. Well, yeah. Oh my god. You're in mother Jesus. Like I said, mother fucker. Let's be clear. That's a good looking car. The Nissan NXR coupe is a bloody good looking car. I got to tell you. Anyway, aside from the insults, because it even had a targer roof, you could take the roof section. Patrick, can we stop talking about your car? I think we spoke about it five times as podcast. Could you get on to some tech news? Right. Okay. My latest app session. Can I tell you about my

48:34latest app? Yeah. For God's sake, just don't talk about you fucking broken window again. I never use it in my car. Okay. You're not allowed to use your apps on your phone. I found I discovered this app recently called Yucca. Why UKA? And what it is, it's a free app. It doesn't have ads, but you do have a subscription tier. But you can go to the supermarket and scan the barcode of all the products in the supermarket. And it tells you whether it's good. It gives you a breakdown and it says, okay, this is good for this reason, this reason, this reason, but it's bad for that reason. It might have too many, too caloric. So it might have too many calories or it might have preservatives in it that are known to be harmful. It has changed the way I shop for stuff. You know, I use coconut cream in a lot of my pasta sources, because I don't use real cream. But there were nine different creams and coconut milks and only one of them rated good.

49:37The rest of them were rated bad. So that the apps fantastic. And the other thing that I can do is I can see, you can set filters. So if you say, for example, we're gluten intolerant, you could set a gluten intolerant feature. And then when you scan stuff without having to read the barcode or read the contents, it'll instantly tell you whether it's safe for you to have or if you've got a nut allergy or in my case, I set it for vegan because I can't read bloody labels anymore. I need a magnifying glass or I take a photo with a label and zoom in because it takes forever to work out what all those numbers mean and whether they contain an animal product or if it's nuts or whatever. So it's yeah, it's my absolute obsession. And the more I tell people about it, the more people say, oh yeah, I got it as well. It sounds it's nice. It's got a minute. What's the problem with that, do you think? What's the potential problem with that app? Because I think you and I might be thinking the same thing. I just, I just opened chatters and went, is the yukka app good and what's its philosophy with what is good in food? So I think you have to understand what you

50:40know about food and additives and like a lot of the stuff, David Gillespie talks about about seed oils and everything. And yeah, what's its philosophy and what's it calling? It's like the star rating on foods. Yeah. And do you think also that sorry, Patrick, I think you just, and I'm not saying it's bad. It could be fucking amazing. So there's no judgment, just curiosity. But like for example, we have had too many talks with David Gillespie about seed oils, but there is some astounding science to support what he says. He never makes a claim and doesn't back it up with proper research. And then last night on the news on channel seven, they're like, ah, all the noise about seed oils, it's not true. They're all good. You know, it's like they were just saying the exact opposite. But nobody was referencing anything. Like the thing was, nah, it's not true. I'm a dietician. It's good therefore you should believe me because I'm no fuck that. That's cool. You might be true. You might be right, but give me some science, give me some research, show me evidence that what you're

51:42saying is true. Because these things have been happening for millennia, where we think something and then we find out later, like so many drugs like solidamide that was given to pregnant women for this and that that caused all these deformities. Well, at one stage, this was the right thing. You should have it. And it was devastatingly terrible on women, right? But at one stage, that was good science. So I think we're so gullible that we just go, my question would be with Yaka, as you call it, like who science are you using? Like what are the criteria that you are saying this is good or bad? And how do we know that you are right and the other people who say other things are wrong? That's, and by the way, everyone, I have no opinion on it. It could be bloody brilliant because I haven't even seen it. But that's just what, even when I talk about science, or even when I talk about potential behavior or choices around health and wellness, I go, this is what I think. I don't go, you should all do this because I've read a paper or I've trained

52:45lots of people or yeah, I just think that I think the concept is a good idea, but I would just like to dig in and go, what's the science behind it? And I know that sounds fucking boring and I'm raining on your parade. But I just think, eh, you know, it's like the Hellstar rating system, Gillespie just wrote an article on that. It's fucking incredible. So you get something like a, with the current Hellstar rating system, you can have a, a, a, a serial that's full of process shit and sugar, gets four and a half stars. In fact, he had a photo of one and then he had a free range organic and I know you're not going to want this Patrick, but steak. So it had, the only ingredient was beef. It got zero point five stars compared to process sugary fucking. Now it's like, this is fucking ridiculous. And, and it's based on all of these absolutely flawed criteria and, and, but the one before that, which was the, there's another star rating

53:51system, the way that people got the stars for their product was they bought them. There was no actual analysis like there was no nutritional kind. There was no science behind this rating. It was like, ah, we, we have this. We want to get your endorsement. They're like, wow, it's 30 grand for that. Cool. Here's the 30 or, or whatever. You know, like it's just this stuff is don't believe everything that you hear or see. It's like you've got to learn a bit. Yes, if you've got your fingers twitching, I can tell. Well, it just was reading like one of the points that Chatters makes is that it judges foods in isolation. For example, olive oil loses points for calories, cheese looks worse than diet, yogurt, and honey may not even get a score. So, and then yeah, we're relying on being told what to eat, not how to think about the food we ate. I think the problem is that calories have been demonized. It's like, well, dude, you fucking need calories every day. It's calories aren't good or bad. It's how many you have based on how many you expend. But, but there are some things, certain chemicals and certain flavonoids and fucking

54:58preservatives that are unequivocally bad. So no amount is good. Sorry, Patrick. No, it's been really good at educating myself to ultra-processed stuff, high sodium, that sort of thing. But I think the other thing is the filtering for vegan because I can't read the labels as well as I used to be able to. So being able to quickly do that and walk past. But you know what I found was interesting too, is that sometimes the cheapest stuff on the market in terms of the amount of additives, because really shelf life is one of these things that producers want to be able to have a product that stays on the shelf as long as possible. You know, if you open up a wraps, you know, if you buy wraps at the supermarket, the majority of them have a shelf life of like six months. I don't know any bread product that should last six months. And even when you open it, it can sit in the fridge for two weeks and you think, it hasn't even got any mold on it, you know. Yeah. You got to ask the questions, you know, and those things actually save. I'm making my homemade wraps now. I'm pretty

56:01happy with myself. So I'm just making it from oat flour and linseed that I mill myself. And I've just been... I think that's wise decision. Also, I just wanted to jump back to what you were talking about, the nutritional labels, right? You can't read them. And the reason you can't read them is because it's fucking size four fonts. On the back of the box, down the bottom left or right hand corner, because they don't want it to get any attention. What was in that box was good news for them. It'd be all over the front in big letters. So the front is an ad. It's not information. The shit in that box that they don't want you to read. And the ingredients list that they don't want you to read with all those preservatives, additives, numbers. That's what you fuck the front of the box. It's an ad. It's a trick. It's a fucking... It's a delusion. Like, go to the back and actually try to understand what you're putting in your gob. We've got to go. Give us one more before we go, champ. Your choice. I'm so excited. Next week, we've got a lunar eclipse and made me

57:06think about the new Artemis mission. So the Artemis 2 mission is the astronauts. They're going to be heading off soon this year. In fact, it's only a short time away. And the people in the Artemis spacecraft is going to... We're going to go back to the moon. They're not landing on the moon, but they're going to go around the moon and run all these studies. But because of the placement of the moon, they're going to be the furthest away from earth than any other human being in history. Wow. Wow. They're cool, huh? You would love to go to space when that's like, that'd be you'd probably chop off a knacker for that, wouldn't you? Well, I think last month, last episode, I talked about a company that's sending ashes into space. I think I want to get my ashes sent into space. That's where I'm at. But the other thing that I found interesting about the Artemis mission is they're equipping the astronauts with 10-year-old DSLR cameras, Nikon Cameras, because there was a Nikon camera that came out, which is kind of fascinating.

58:07The camera is a 2020... 2016 camera, the D5 Nikon camera. And it's got a... It's more resilient to radiation. And it has a much higher ISO rating. So ISO is the sensitivity to light. And it had this ridiculously good sensitivity built into it. That's more than the current Nikons, which is fascinating. And it means we get that contrast between the darkness of space and any object they're taking photographs of. So that's what they're taking with them. 10-year-old cameras are going to be flying around with human beings and they're going to be the furthest away that any humans ever been in history. Look at you just bringing the bloody facts and the amusement and the end of time. Now I heard that you had your car broken into. Patrick, of course, can be... Somebody wrote in the group, I hate it when you ask Patrick where people can find you. Because they don't like... So now I'm scared, but oh well,

59:13that's okay. If anybody can contact me, they can just go to website snow.com.au and fill out the form and just say hi. Let us know what you want us to talk about. Oh, okay. I was unaware. Thank you for bringing that up. Yeah, no problem. Tiff, did you know that? We're just nice to know that it was Craig would ask more often. Yeah, I know. And also, Tai Chi at home.com.au. I have always free exercises and you can meet Fritz, the one-to-dog, and we can do Tai Chi together. Well, yes. And also everyone, he doesn't get paid. So give him a break. He's allowed to promote. He's weak, give him fuck all. He's only got... He's got a devalued car now. He lives in fucking upper... Oh, I can't say what I was going to say, but it would have been hilarious. I thought he was going to say it. Yes, exactly. But you know, who would have sent us an email? Someone. Tiff, thank you. Have a good Friday, both you. We'll say goodbye for you, but thanks both you and thanks, listeners.