1776 Law Center convention, episode 3

0:00Welcome to this special in-person episode of the Nurses Report here on the America Out Loud Network. We are in-person because we are attending the 1776 law firm convention down in Chattanooga, Tennessee. Nicole, can you tell us a little about this convention? Absolutely. So this is the 1776 Law Center conference that is put together to help those who cannot afford counsel and public advocates to possibly help with certain cases. Also, competent counsel and public advocates, especially when their case broadly impacts the liberties of all Americans in their freedom to do what we basically put in our bodies, our defense of self-free elections and financial empowerment. It encompasses really political freedom, food freedom, medical freedom, and financial freedom. One of the reasons we're supportive of this effort is because we see all these various systems that Nicole just named in need of reform. But unfortunately,

1:05a lot of the lawsuits involved are going to be air-quost-losing lawsuits in terms of what the final verdict is from the judge. But what's also equally important is the verdict of public opinion. That's why these lawsuits are so important, even if we don't get the verdict that we want, because fighting the good fight means shining a light on some of these things. Ashley, docs? Yeah, it's been a really amazing event. We had the pleasure of meeting Brooke Jackson and you guys met Dr. Mary Talley Bowden. And I got to be really honest. A lot of times I've said this even yesterday, don't meet your heroes, right? Because a lot of times they're not what you would expect. But in my conversations with Brooke Jackson, I was not disappointed. In fact, I was very impressed because she's super down to earth. She's a very real person. She's doing this for the right reasons. It is amazing to see somebody like that and it just really makes your heart happy. And so

2:10in this 1776 law conference, to be able to hear that there are other people out there like that is really empowering because the work that we do, I guess we forgot to introduce ourselves a little bit, Ashley Grog as a nurse who's just kind of in broken hearted and disenchanted by the system. I left. And I do still use my nursing skills, but it's not in the same way. And so now my mission is to help other nurses avoid that. And so that's giving tools like resuscitating nursing, working on healing, moral injury. And I think we're going to talk about that more. Dave, do you want to go ahead and introduce yourself real quick before? My name is David Wayne. I'm a nurse with a background in hospital psychiatry. That made me grow skeptical about big pharma because of the scandals that I would see around psych meds, which made me a COVID vaccine skeptic and COVID dissident overall, which made me a fired nurse, which made me a podcaster with these two. Lucky guy. So lucky. And I go by a nurse Nicole, a central Florida registered nurse for over 20

3:11years now in the acute care setting, predominantly working in the hospital setting as a cardiac nurse. And I was one of the nurses that came forward during the pandemic when our transplant patients who receiving the vaccines were being harmed and some of them were not making it. And so since then, working on a local and state level to ensure people understand in our community what their rights are, what bodily sovereignty means, and the right to inform consent. So this is really a great conference to tie some of these things in because when you feel like you're working in these settings, and there isn't as many people as we've been in probably six years into this that are understanding and grasping the severity that we're just basically getting started. It's nice to go to a conference to meet other individuals who have stood in this fight and continue to do so. And are doing so with integrity. Absolutely. And then because it's so it can be such a struggle to maintain a positive attitude to feel like, why am I doing this? Why am I sacrificing time with my family financially? I mean,

4:12this impacts our lives globally. And it's also a lot of stress and anxiety and you know, all these things. And so when you come to a place like this and you're able to talk with these people, it's a breath of fresh air. In addition to that, some would look at this as kind of a negative, but we're also seeing how, you know, we had Speaker James Webb. And we're seeing how there are a lot of parallels between nursing and the military and how a lot of these problems, and I might be jumping the gun here, but a lot of these problems are moral issues, culturally driven moral issues. And we also saw how these people are coming from all different backgrounds. They're coming with different political views sometimes. And they don't all agree. And it's really refreshing to be in a situation where you can have a variety of people, the variety of different backgrounds,

5:14but we're all focused on healing humanity is the way I would put it. I don't know if they would say it that way, but healing humanity so that we can maintain the gift of freedom that we have here in America, right? Yeah, I was really interesting to hear how people in completely different occupations than nursing were facing the exact same tough choices that nurses were facing during the COVID pandemic. And before like, like, like, clarified. Yeah, it's just kind of a global nursing issue. And one of the things that I got completely wrong during the pandemic is when stuff really started to go off the rails, I thought there would be all these nurses and all these doctors standing up and speaking truth to power. And it just didn't happen. It just did not happen. And that was, that was frankly shocking to me as completely unexpected. And what we saw at the conference were people from all these different industries. Some of them had a background in intelligence,

6:14like the CIA or the State Department, or they were in various branches of the military and levels levels and levels. And they saw the exact same thing. They saw most people keeping their head down, keeping quiet, getting along just just by, I don't know, by not rocking the boat. Yeah. And they knew that their jobs were on the line. They knew that their careers were on the line. They wanted to keep a roof over their head. They wanted to provide for their family. They wanted to feed their kids all obviously very, very important things. But it kept them quiet. It made them, well, it made them clients and it cracked their integrity. Sorry to say like, if you know something's wrong and you don't say something, I think it's Q plus C quiet plus compliant equals a loss of integrity. And we saw that a lot and something that we continue to, I guess, really get a lot of kind of

7:15the same responses because people always ask, you know, how do you stand out from others, making the choices that you did to walk away or to maybe standing your convictions and actually get fired when other people felt so strongly a different way to make those decisions to stay in their profession because they wanted to keep a roof over their head or keep their job not lose their pension, their ranking, you know, and obviously we had different things. And the Nurses Report, you know, your Friday Q and A group that came from these backgrounds during the pandemic that did affect us deeply in a lot of ways. And so I think it was really interesting to hear these individuals state those very things. Like we realized people felt compelled to stay where they were because they didn't feel like they had a choice where they wanted to keep the, you know, peace, their pension, you know, and a roof over their heads. But then also understanding that, I think it was, was a James Webb that said, you know, at this point to lay his head at night knowing he did the right thing the way he was raised his faith, he could not fathom staying quiet when he knew certain things

8:20were not right. And just how important it was for him to speak up. So I just think it really spoke volumes for the individuals that we specifically heard today and how they, you know, portrayed that strength and bravery and why that stood out for the decisions that they made when they could have just been like others and kept their head down. So one of the tough decisions that people will face is, you know what, this system has these huge problems. I am really motivated to make good changes and I can only do that if I stay in. So how do you balance that? How do you balance staying in to a system that you know is broken where harm is being done and they're doing things wrong? But your only chance to change it is if you stay in versus walking away and what James Webb ended up saying is if you have to sell your soul to do it, then it's time to, then it's time to walk away. Does that resonate with either of you as nurses? I mean, I know for me, I know so many

9:21nurses who walked away during COVID or you who kind of walked away from establishment nursing even earlier. Ten years ago. Yeah. Yeah. It does. And I think people have to know their boundaries and we've had some of these conversations already tonight on different topics. You have to know what you can handle and what you can't. And in my journey, so you know, from the time I was a nurse, became a nurse in 2006, I had a couple years where it was good. I mean, it wasn't great, but it was good. And we had really good teamwork. Staffing was decent. We weren't having, you know, seven, eight patients. Right. And then the shift started. Our company got bought out a couple of time. And it was a mess. In that time, I would do everything I could to advocate to speak up. I ended up on every single committee in the hospital, legitimately, every single committee in the hospital,

10:22even so much that the director of cardiac services knew that. Okay. My manager's manager wrote knew that. And it was sucking my soul out. That's how I describe it. I felt like no matter what I did, no matter how hard I tried. And you all know me. I'm very to the point. It didn't matter. Nobody listened. Nobody cared. They kept on instituting stupid policy after stupid policy that was punitive. And so I just got to the point where I felt like I maxed out my ability to impact change. Had I known what I know now, I would have taken that hospital over and ran that place. That's why I wrote recessed Tate nursing, but I didn't. And so I walked away. And that probably that probably saved me a lot of suffering. And sometimes I feel guilty during COVID, I felt really guilty because I thought I could maybe go back and at least help alleviate some of the suffering of my former coworkers because our unit did get turned into the COVID unit. I thought that maybe I

11:25could bring comfort to patients. But I knew if I put myself in that position again, my stone heart would not survive. And so I had to draw a boundary and I couldn't, I wasn't going to participate. I wasn't going to play. And you know, that's what I did. So it's different from what you guys are doing. Like I have a lot of admiration for you guys being able to stay in there. I just, I knew my boundaries and I couldn't. I mean, I stayed. I paid for it dearly. It was definitely something that was, it was a constant. You know, I was looked at as a trader from even our own medical freedom groups, not understanding why if the establishment was as bad as it was and the protocols were being implemented and things were happening. How could I be a part of that? But still fight against trying to protect, you know, medical freedom and going against the mandates, which I did. And so, you know, to that point, I did suffer. It did have a huge impact, you know, trauma wise. But I stayed because, you know, if everybody left what what the vulnerable patients have and

12:30not to say that I was the only one, but there are others that stayed who had the same mentality. And we were able to kind of be a buffer between those patients. We were able to make sure that we protected them as best we could. And we had conversations and we involved family. Even though we knew certain policies and protocols and you know, everything was being implemented incorrectly. And we saw what it was doing that we still spoke up. We showed up. We tried to change the culture within. And I would say it worked for a period of time because the establishment was very much pushing against us. They segregated us. We were co-horced. We were not allowed to be in the same break room. You know, we had to wear different stickers on our badge to identify that we were on vaccinated. They did everything they could to drive us out to make sure that they knew we were not welcome. That we were not part of the team. And so it was a constant ebb and flow of, you know, you don't belong here and whatever they could do to make you miserable and walk out. And so, um, enduring that for years obviously takes a toll, but the goal was to protect the patients.

13:31You have to have advocates. You have to have people willing to say up and do hard things. And, you know, I think we really accomplished a lot of that. And there would have been more people harmed. Had everybody left. And so I appreciate both sides because like, like Ashley said, you have to know where you draw the line. But obviously our trauma is different and we endured very different things. But, you know, that is very powerful that there's different people and different arenas within the healthcare field, the legal field that shows these paths that did have a form of suffering, if you will, but, you know, stayed in their faith and their convictions to try to do the right thing for people that didn't have a voice. So, you know, I appreciate that very much that that happened. Yeah. There is this predatory force out there that takes advantage of the good nature of nurses, these human beings who puts their patients first and care so much about their patients that they will endure these personal struggles. There's this force out there that takes advantage of that, that takes advantage of the way that they will not let their patients down. And it's,

14:38it's almost weaponized against them. And I think with the military, it's the same way. It's because they have that. It's the brotherhood. You do not want to let your brother down. That is your brother. You have been through life and death together. That person is as close as any family member and they know that they don't want to let each other down. And how many of those guys got up there and said, these are, these are my brothers. We've been through hell together. I just want to make sure they get home. Right. And then there's also that guilt aspect of if I, if I leave, if I walk out now, rather than reenlist, then they don't know what's going on over there. And I can't help them. And they talked about this time and time again, where, you know, you have these new young guys coming into the military and they have no clue. They're not getting that the support they need. And it's a mess. Right. So one of the comments that was made was that,

15:42by one of the military guys was that he came from a military family. So generation after generation after generation served. They served in the Civil War. They served in World War One, World War Two, Korea, Vietnam. And then he served in Iraq and Afghanistan. And he said he got to a point where he actually wouldn't recommend that his own child serve in the military because of where we've gotten. And I've heard the same thing from nurses, you know, nurses sometimes have family traditions like that too, where it's a whole family of nurses or whole family of healthcare professionals. And a lot of them are now saying, I've heard it, I wouldn't recommend anybody go to nursing school at this point. And honestly, that's where I'm at at this point. And people might disagree with me, but looking at what new grad nurses face, I mean, go to welding school and make six digits and be

16:42able to sleep at night, you know, like take up a trade, do something where you're not going to be replaced by AI in 10 years where you don't have to sell your soul, where you're not given these ridiculous unfair patient assignments. And then thrown under the bus, the second something goes wrong that really isn't your fault because you're so set up for failure. They put into place. Yeah. But people always ask, like, why did you become a nurse? Like, knowing that we're not the only profession, although it's a huge profession and it's one that's extremely broken, but what other jobs are out there that when people talk about you would just be like, why on earth would anybody want to do this? Because of the suffering, because of the brokenness, but then there's like, you have to have people that are built for these jobs. So it's like, how do you navigate and understand who's a good fit for that? Because some of them like social workers, you know, police officers, you know, there's different professions that really go through hard times, day in and day at

17:45high liability, you know, high sadness, high trauma, and still be able to perform in very broken systems. Yeah. Even in across the nursing spectrum, like, keep me out of OB, man, I ain't going there. And so it is very difficult. Nursing was definitely a calling for me just from my personal experience. And it's really hard to give that up. I still, I do miss, I miss the old bedside nursing. I miss where I could love on my patients and take care of them, not only do the physical aspects of healing, but the emotional and spiritual. And that connection is what I miss so much. And sometimes I'll, I'll be able to do some consulting or some education or somebody's got a complex case where they're at the hospital and I'll be able to sit down with them and do a lot of education. And those are the moments that bring my heart so much joy because I know that I am taking fear

18:47out of a really difficult situation. I'm not fixing it by any means. I'm not going to make their journey easier in the physical sense, but I give them peace and understanding so they can make the best decisions for their care, make sure that their needs, wants and desires are met. And, the beauty of nursing is to be able to give that to another human being and say, I know that this is really tough, but I love you and I'm going to care for you and, and mean it. You know, that with integrity, with empathy, obviously with compassion, but also too, you have to be on your game, you have to be, you know, smart about things, you know, science flows and constantly is changing and we should be able to question the science and move with things that are changing. So, and again, in the military, the same thing, legal, it's a constant ebb and flow and we, they talked about these cases, you know. So Dave wouldn't recommend, you know, anybody going in, where are you at right now? Would you recommend people going into nursing or?

19:52So I feel like it's a little question, but I feel that it is so broken that it would be really difficult for me to want to say yes, because the systems that are in place on every level are so compromised and so broken that we are just setting them up to fail. So unless we get that foundation completely, you know, burn it to the ground is like we like to say and really work it up. I feel like we're leading, leading lands to slaughter. I mean, at that point, there's just even if they get in, now we know that they're requiring the vaccine, see it into schools, and then you go in, there's this indoctrination as we see with other stuff, then it's like, do you have to do your clinicals? They're going to talk about vaccines again, and there's just a whole bunch of different things that I feel like by the time they even get out if they do, then they're going into these professions in healthcare that they just don't have good leaders, good resources. They don't have the longevity to learn from people who, you know, left during the pandemic, and so it's really a different culture, and I think people will agree,

20:55they see this now. Anytime you go to a doctor's office or you go to a hospital or you're going to certain settings and healthcare, depending the state that you're in, you may notice a very diverse type of nursing education levels, empathy or not. And so I think people really have a bad taste in their mouth about healthcare, and the nurses who used to be looked at very highly are now like being questioned for their validity, are they really wanting to be here because it seems as if some of the newer generations are just in it for a paycheck and really just want the bare minimum, you know, to be done and then move on. And that's just not what most of us went into healthcare for. Yeah. I think we've talked about this a couple times. My masters is in education. No, I wanted to teach nurses because I loved precepting and being able to educate and light that fire in people's hearts and give them the tools that they needed to do. Right. What we love to do. And I became so bitter and angry because when I started interviewing for positions, I

22:02our community is small and I would get contacted and I was basically being told that part of the reason that the nurse left before me that I was going to take her job was because they were requiring her to push students through without passing grades. And I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, yeah, I don't play those games. Yeah. And I was finding this across the board and it was really difficult for me to deal with that because the fact that while book smarts is not everything, these students have to be prepared to work hard, to learn a lot of information, to persevere, you know, all these things. And so to just pass somebody through because you need a good pass rate for the board or for, you know, admission stats or whatever, that's not acceptable. And so I went through a long period and that was, boss, seven, eight years ago. I went through this period where I was very angry. I was very bitter. COVID absolutely just sent that through the roof. But over probably the last year and a half, two years, I've started to, you know, look around and

23:04say, you know what, I would be very honest and give people informed decision making. And then I would say, look, I'm going to be here to support you. I'm going to do the best I can. We are getting students into nursing school without vaccinations that is happening. Like that is happening in Indiana past the law last year that nursing students are certain licensed professionals can use a religious exemption for clinicals. So that has, that aspect has been improved. We've, there's no enforcement. So we're yet to see how that's going to roll through. We're just getting to those students. But my position has definitely changed. And I'm to the point now where we need good nurses. We need them in there. We need to be honest with them. We need to let them know what to prepare for. And then we've got to find a way to gather around them. And instead of eating our young, we have to be able to feed them. And I don't know how to do that from the outside. That's very difficult. I've been giving out books to a lot of new grads. But I think it's going to take our community. It's

24:08going to take all of us to work on this. And we kind of have to sort that out and come to terms with culture change. That's a culture change. No doubt. Culture change comes from good leaders. And you mentioned good leaders. And one of the things that various presenters brought up was recently we've seen that good managers are the ones who have been promoted, whether it's in the military or it's in healthcare. They're good managers because they are really organized. They've got all the plates spinning and none of the plates are falling. They're able to send all the emails. They're able to make all the meetings and they're able to do all the things. But is that a good leader? They're bureaucrats. They're very good at those bureaucratic skills. But they're not necessarily a good leader. And that failure of leadership was glaringly obvious during COVID. And so with that in mind, we're going to take a break. We're going to hear from some sponsors. And we will be right back

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27:17Hello and welcome back to the Nurses Report here on the America out loud network. Before the break, we were talking about the 1776 Law Center conference that we attended, which had a variety of speakers from different industries. Some of them were from healthcare, like us, but we also heard several people from the military. And one of them in particular that we've been talking about in the first half of this episode was James Webb. And some of the things that he pointed out with the military, we were all going, oh yeah, that's exactly like hospitals today. So we were talking about having good managers versus good leaders and how, boy, during COVID, the lack of good leadership was glaringly obvious in the hospitals and really let us down. He was talking about how they had good managers, but they didn't have good leaders during Iraq and Afghanistan. So speaking of Iraq and Afghanistan, he talked about how they stopped

28:18collecting data that people up the ranks, up the chain of hierarchy, didn't really want to see. They wanted to be fed good information. And you were almost, you were almost punished for being honest. If it was data that that your superiors didn't want to see and boy, is that sound like hospitals at home? Like, that hit, that hit, yeah. Well, and again, something we still see today, I mean, could be agree that it's not consistent. They're constantly still discrepancies. We're seeing one thing and other things being reported. You know, we dissect some of these things on the nurse's report. And it's just wild that we haven't seen to learn. And so to hear that it's also happening in the military, it's absolutely terrifying because obviously this is our defense against protecting the Americans. But, you know, goes to show that again, we're not very far off between the military, legal, field and health care.

29:21Well, and the fact that we all know people in the military and their lives are literally on the line in those moments. And there were some stories shared about loss, unnecessary loss of life. And then the way that the propaganda machine spins that so it looks good. And that tore me up. Yeah, that was terrible. It hit very close to home, but as far as the respect of relating to nursing, but also the fact that these are our young men and women. And you talk about leading the lamb to slaughter. Right. And the fact that this is just like, what, what the hell happened to no man look behind? Yeah. Same thing with other in the pandemic. We saw one thing happening. It was, you know, not being reported as such. And it caused a lot of confusion. And there was a lot of people that unnecessarily died for no reason. And it can always haunt me because you saw it happening. You're screaming into the void as Dave likes to say. And it continued to happen. And the people

30:26that spoke today at the conference, you know, Brooke Jackson and Dr. Bowden. It's so apparent that they saw things in the beginning that they were screaming into the void to try to put out there to get it out to help raise awareness and save lives and talking about not being able to speak about certain things and the DOJ coming down and putting stipulations and almost like a gag order, if you will, knowing this whole time that, you know, Americans could have heard what was really happening. And instead the silence that they were forced caused all those unnecessary harm and death and people that could have possibly been saved. Have they been allowed to speak on it? Well, they talked about with the military industry of conflicts and how the way that these things are used and the information is presented, manipulated, I mean, allegedly, that it would completely change our perception of whether or not we should be informed wars. And, you know, I'm of the mind of no, like, why are we doing

31:26this? Why are we sending our men and women to do these things? It's just so infuriating and it's devastating. I mean, to know that this is, and it's not just isolated to military and nursing or military and medicine, we know that this is in a lot of different areas too. We saw that Barnes talked a lot about how that's in law and you talk about that all the time. Like, it wouldn't be so bad if we just had a justisism that worked. There was actually functional. Right. One of the things that James Webb talked about was that in Iraq, they had people there who were true believers. They really believed in the war on terror. They believed that removing Saddam Hussein was this amazing thing and definitely not saying Saddam Hussein's a great guy or anything like that, but they really, really believed in the mission. And at some point, a lot of them would have some sort of experience that was a wake up call. Like, they would see a group of Sunni Muslims that they

32:34had armed with American weapons getting into just vicious shootouts with Shia Muslims that they had also armed that were supposed to be on the same team, but had these longstanding tribal and religious conflicts with each other that just spilled over in this whole process. And then, of course, you know, Americans get kind of caught in the middle of all that. And for a lot of them, that would be the wake up call when they would see something like that happen firsthand. And that really makes me think of Nurse Michelle, one of our Nurse colleagues who also is trying to speak truth to power. She always talks about how an anti-vaxxer isn't born they're made. It's a mama bear who had one of their own children injured by a vaccine. It's somebody who saw something first hand. That's how an anti-vaxxer ends up being made. And so I thought that there was a lot of parallel

33:35there as well. Agreed. Yeah. And that's an important part to make because a lot of times the perception is one way, but people need to understand that I'll speak for myself. I wasn't always like this. There are things that have happened in the healthcare field that you see and go through that just forever changes you. And that is something that you have to learn to work through and you know, navigate what that new normal looks like. We see it in police officers. We see it in firefighters. We see it again, social workers in the military, the trauma PTSD. They're all very much intertwined, but it's important to know that usually it's something that you've encountered, whether it's you personally a child, somebody you know, and you endure these things in it, forever changes and alters your chemical makeup, if you will. And that's how people use that normally for good to try to make change and really try to move forward with a mission to make sure it doesn't happen to someone else. So we have the military industrial complex. We have the medical

34:37industrial complex. So many parallels there. One of them that we talked about at the conference was there is this pressure on you that for career advancement, you have to serve certain agendas. And so you end up with these people in these top positions of power where if you're not serving that same agendas, sorry, you don't get any real power. You don't get promoted. And trying to predict where this is going, what happens from here? One of the one of the military guys who achieved a pretty high rank said, you know, I don't think the military is going to change until we get our asses handed to us on the battlefield in some foreign conflict. And we literally have to retreat in defeat. And only something as catastrophic as that is actually going to lead to the sort of widespread and very, very deep changes that that we need because we're just so entrenched in this system that we have right now, you know, taking five years to build one missile by hand. And

35:44we we've fallen behind. And I think that the same could be said of health here. I think that we are so entrenched right now and you don't get ahead. We know this from all the pharma lawsuits. We look at you definitely don't get ahead and big pharma unless you are willing to do the magic math unless you are willing to literally sacrifice lives for profit. You you have to be literally willing to kill children for profit to make it to the top ranks of pharmaceutical companies. And I know that sounds like an incredibly salacious and defamatory claim. But look up Paxle study 329 if you want one specific example that is exactly what they did. Look at Viox. Look at what they do with the vaccine clinical trials. Like that is the name of the game. And so what does that look like? You know, if on the military side, it's some sort of resounding foreign military defeat that's going to change the system. Like what needs to happen with our with our health care system with the medical industrial complex before we see change? Because I don't know what more we need to see our

36:48life expectancy is going down our the number of chronic diseases we have is going up our kids are less healthy like it's bankrupting us. It's absolutely bankrupting the country. So like we've already suffered the defeat. Like I don't know what more needs to happen. Do you guys have any ideas? I mean, I thought the pandemic would be a prime example. I mean, to stop referencing that, but it's true. It's it's so pivotal in health care, but you know, just like Dave said with the military, we see it in health care all the time. If you don't comply, if you don't follow the rules, if you're not a yes person, if you're not constantly bending over backwards and doing more than your fair share all the time, you know, you may not be looked at for that promotion. You know, you're not going to sit there in advance into certain rules. They want a specific type of person. And you know, that leads a lot of people who don't always have the best intentions to keep climbing to the to the top. And I say it's called it's called failing upwards. We're putting people in

37:50positions of power that don't deserve to be there, but because they agree and they just go with the flow and being told what to do, that makes them exactly who these sea sweets want them to be. And who suffers the team, the patients, you know, the communities. And so it continues to drive health care to the ground, in my opinion. And that's why it's so unfortunate that even people that I've worked with who have had amazing intentions. And we've talked about this before. Good people, I've been there, you know, you try to do the right thing. The second you are pro-nors or you go against that status quo, those top of, you know, leaders will come for you and basically run you out. I mean, they, and you talked about this the other day with one of the nurses that you worked with. And it's so unfortunate that these people who have good intentions and want to do the right thing, the second they try to implement things in a higher level of leadership, they're immediately shot down and basically, you know, set up to fail. I talked about this with Brooke today, because

38:52I don't think it can be burnt to the ground. You would have to take out big hospital. You would have to take out big pharma, because big pharma is perpetuating unhealthiness. You know, you look at OZM pick in the way. I mean, it's just a complete mess. So I don't think it can be burnt down. I think that there is so much money and power in that. And the base, you know, when you have military men that are watching each other get slaughtered, you have a good chance of them, you know, rising up and pushing back. But when you have an entire country that is facing this, that would be much more difficult. And this is the whole reason that I wrote resuscitating nursing, because the change nursing is the largest medical profession. We run the hospitals, whether we think we do or not. And until, you know, it's like if you have a mom that just lets her kids get away with murder, they're going to be wild hellians. But you get that mom that's like, okay, I've had enough.

39:55So you're about down. We're taking care of this. As soon as you see that happen, it cannot just be one nurse. This responsibility is on all of us. And so it's going to take all of us to do this. You know, I talked about informed consent with nurses going back into the profession or nurses going into the profession, not back, but into the profession. It's about informed consent. Look, I'm telling you this is not going to be easy. I say that over and over again in my book. This is not going to be easy. You're not going to be liked. It's not glamorous. It's not fun. But if you care, you're going to have to step up and you're going to have to be willing to live with integrity. You're going to have to live in congruence with your morals. And as a nurse, our morals can be very difficult because we have to remember that our duty is to that patient. And so it's not about our beliefs for their care. It's about giving them the tools that they need to make the decisions to care for themselves or make those decisions on their own that that meet their needs, you know, physical, emotional, spiritual, etc. So that can be very

41:01difficult. You also, I don't think I said leader yet. Did I? You have to be willing to be a leader. And that looks different for everybody. And if you can't be a leader, you need to help find the leaders. You need to find the people who don't want to be in politics, who don't really want the role. Did you want to do this? No, I didn't want to do this. Did you want to do this? Oh, okay. So we've got to find these people. And that's what they said. A lot of these military guys said that it's not about an even Mr. Barris talked about the politician is not necessarily the one who wants the job, but the one who's going to act with integrity. So we find those people. And we build, we insulate them. We support them unionizing. I'm going to catch mad hell for this. Unionizing is not the answer. Why? Because you're adding another political party into the mix. Read my book. You'll find out why. But we need organic grassroots nurses to take over. Because you are, you have so much power and you have so much heart. And you're going to act with integrity

42:07because this is your community. These are your people. These are your co-workers. And so you are going to push for what's best in that community. Because why? Because your heart won't let you do otherwise. And so until we see these people step up who are willing to do the hard ugly work, who are willing to be leaders, who are willing to help find them, it's not going to change. Because big pharma will not let it die. And we'll see this like we talked about on the last podcast. We will see that we get to the point where it feels impossible, which I think we're there, right? We'll see it flip and snowball really quickly. Because momentum and inertia is this powerful force. And it's not only with the physical matter, but with emotions and ideas and spirituality. And if this is a spiritual war, which it is, like I hate to break it to you, but this is a spiritual war. This is not of the flesh, but of the spirit. You will see that energy and that excitement just start to amplify. And that is what I hold hope for. And that is what I pray that I can

43:13bring to people. And that is why I'm bringing the moral injury book. Because as soon as we can take and shift some of this guilt and shame, and we can accept the fact that, you know, we deserve to heal from this. But our peers deserve to heal from this. That then we will be able to take that next step because it eliminates some of that fear. And we heard them speak to that. You know, change your motivation, change your perspective. There was something in regards to that. I can't remember the quote. But so that's what I'm doing. It's not easy. It's not sexy. It ain't paying. So, um, you know, come join me. It's a lot of. Yeah. You mean great friends. Look at this. I feel so great friends. You mentioned nursing. Uh, or you mentioned unions. And I have to say during the pandemic when all the COVID vaccine mandates were flying around the country, I couldn't find a single healthcare worker union that was pushing back against vaccine mandate. You're right. I mean, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it was one of their. But I looked for them. I could not. Yeah. I

44:13could not find any. One thing you said that I might push back on was about, I think you said, you know, when in the military when people are getting slaughtered, maybe that's when somebody stands up and pushes back and gets somewhere, I think what we heard is that those are the people who are weeding out. Like those squeaky wheels, uh, get, get removed. Uh, one of the things Larry Johnson said was that ignorant leaders are not punished. That's one of the problems that they are running into in the intelligence services. He has a state department and CIA background. He said, uh, you don't get rewarded for flagging a problem. Uh, I think that's just like health care too. Uh, he said that in order for your career to advance, you have to tell leadership what they want to hear, not the truth. And it's like, well, that's, I feel like he could be. I feel like it's a, all right. Well, write this data. What is Dave second? Yes. I'm about to just so, I don't know, is it, is it validating that these other industries are

45:16facing the exact same problems that we are in in health care. It's, uh, I think it, I think it, I think it goes to what we talk about all the time is the health care system is so broken because these other systems are broken. The judicial system completely broken, the legislative system completely broken. That's why health care is broken. It's not broken by itself. It's broken in the context of all these other broken things and that overlaps with everything. It overlaps with the military. It overlaps with intelligence services. Yeah. Well, and it's just unfortunate because instead of it being its own entity, there should be some sort of push to try to bring it all together because they do intertwine and show the similarities. I mean, when I think people realize that it's not just your profession or that it's not just your group that you're not alone, that this makes it easier to identify, hey, this is a problem everywhere. And what can we do to join forces? Why is it so divided all the time when we do a lot of things that have to do with

46:18health care and things being broken and then it going to the legal system and then the legal system not open up holding their end of the deal corrupt judges and these DAs and everybody else making poor decisions because oh, big farmers coming in and they're lobbyists are paying to basically go against the what should be really done. And so again, it's very much put together and people don't always see it like that. I mean, we see it because we talk about it on the Nurseries report, but a lot of people don't make that connection and that's really important to know. I think going back to what we were talking about in the beginning, I think this is where it's still heartbreaking. It's still frustrating. But when you can look over and say, I see you, I see your busting your butt to fix your profession. This is where we dig deeper. And it's not that we take comfort or joy. It's heartbreaking to listen to these stories because you can relate to that pain and suffering and that desire to do better. But when we see that we are the American spirit is live and well, we are all fighting for humanity. And you know, let's dig deeper and

47:24bring more people into the fight. I mean, nobody's coming to save you. Yeah, we can't say that enough. You have to take accountability. You have to be want want to be involved. I mean, again, like we just said, none of us signed up for this. I did not go into nursing thinking at some point I'd go into politics and want to be in front of, you know, politicians and know as much as we do because sometimes turning a blind eye just seems like it would be much easier to deal with mentally, emotionally, spiritually, etc. But once you cross over, you don't get a chance to go back. Once your eyes are open, the veil has been lifted. We don't have that luxury anymore. And so people are suffering and we want people to understand that it is what it is. It's not going to get better unless people are willing to admit that there's a problem. And in their own way, how can you get involved? What does that look like? Because I mean, waiting on us to do something, it's not enough. There's not enough of us. And it doesn't always work out. And people are still suffering. People are dying. And this is in the military. This is in healthcare. You know, there's all kinds of corruption.

48:26And the more we bring awareness to it, the more we talk about these hard subjects that we highlight these cases like Dave does with these sane lawsuits. You know, we talk about local and state politics, Ashley and I, it drives it to the public to understand that we are everyday normal people who just kind of got brought into this. And then if we can do it, you can absolutely do it. And I think that's so important because we always talk about things and people will say it's really negative. It's really a downer. It's so depressing. Like, you know, what do we do? What is the solution? And I think that's fair that we talk about, you know, what people can do. How can this relate to you and what you do in everyday life to participate as a productive member of society? Well, and why not ask your peers? I mean, I think that's a huge piece that we're missing here. We've found some peers in this 1776 conference learning from each other, hearing the stories and just, you know, maybe not feeling so alone. How can you do that in your own communities?

49:28Right. Well, it's as simple as opening your mouth and asking, hey, have you noticed that insert problem here? Right. What do you think could be a solution? Or even starting the conversation, but saying, look, I don't, I don't want to just rehash this. I'm looking for solutions. Would you be willing to help me brainstorm about things that we can do to help this situation? You're bringing people in together. You're maybe having the conversations. Maybe it doesn't go well. The first time, maybe it doesn't go well the second time, but eventually you'll find somebody that you can work with and reach out to us and to send us a message. We'd love to hear from you and help. And in terms of finding somebody that you can work with, one of the points that was made was that all these systems are broken, not because we've got Republicans and they break things and Democrats, they break these other things. What we have really is a uniparty system.

50:29And we are teased that the really important things are these culture war issues like abortion, like gender affirming care, like boys in the locker room, like bodily autonomy, like women's rights, and we're put at each other's throats to distract from the fact that we actually have a uniparty. And we've said a lot. The purpose of a system is what it does. These systems are completely broken. Well, you have a lot more in common with your neighbor that might be voting way differently than you on so many things. You're both so American in so many ways. And don't be distracted. Keep your focus on the real enemy and keep fighting the good fight. And that's the politicians, not your neighbor and the media. The media is the real virus. I almost brought that t-shirt to where I kind of wish I would have now. It's true. I mean, and as Dave said,

51:34it's finding that community, finding like-minded people, and really understanding that we do not have to agree on everything. I feel like we lost that art to debate, to have differences, to be able to not agree with everything without being completely lambasted. So I mean, that's a huge point, just because we don't necessarily see eye to eye on everything doesn't mean that you couldn't join forces to make change. A lot of this is with people who don't have the same ideologies as we do. We all have very strong opinions on certain things, but at the end of the day, our mission is to educate and raise awareness, bring this information so that the individual can make their own choices, their own decisions. It's not to necessarily think like us. It's to make sure that you have the right information. And I just think it's really important to bring up because so many people I think feel as if it doesn't align completely that it's not worth their time or that it's not going to work out. Where if somebody tells you know that you can't move forward. And Dave mentioned this on a

52:36previous episode where he wanted to make change with education when it came to anti-depressants. And basically his idea was shut down. And he could have just consumed that, let it happen, and not do anything. And instead he used that to fuel him to now be extremely successful and have it on a national level to ensure now that patients have informed consent for this. And that's because he never said no. He didn't let that happen. So we just want people to feel empowered that many people are told no all the time. And you could end it there, but we keep going. And that's partly why we are the way we are on the nurses report because we just we don't take no for an answer. Just to be clear, it was changed at the national level, not because of the FDA. The FDA still refuses to make that change to the warnings that are given to patients, but through reaching out to vendors who actually responded to seeing the evidence and being poked and saying like, hey,

53:39you got to look at this. You got to change this. So you know, we talk about this incredible David versus Goliath battle that we're in. And I don't want it to seem insurmountable to people. You know, this system's broken. That system was broken. It's all broken. We're all pitted against each other. It's all overwhelming. It's all it's all dark. One of the white pills, one of the glimmers of hope that we were told by one of the presenters is remember these elites who are running all this stuff. They are really stupid. And we really recognize their playbook now. The awareness that is spreading because of conversations like this, because of podcasts like this is going to change the world because man, when we look at these pharma scandals, it is the same playbook over and over and over. And once you learn how to spot it, now you know how to fight back. So actually closing thoughts. It's not going to change the world. It is changed in the world. This is an active

54:40verb, not, you know, a future verb. So with that, I think that's all the time we have for today. Thank you so much for joining us on the nurses report. I love my D and a crew. And I hope you do too. Make sure you catch us every Friday. And then we go to podcasts on Saturday. Have a wonderful day and have hope.