1017 - Mogging in Agharta feat. Will Sommer (3/9/26)

0:00. . . . . Greetings, friends. It's Monday, March 9th, and this is your choppo. Obviously, on the last couple episodes, Felix and I have been talking to people about the war in Iran as that continues to unfold. But on today's episode, we're going to look at how the war might be playing out on the domestic political front. And to that end, we are joined by our friend, Will Sumer, from the Bullwark and the online council of Will's,

1:03of which both of us are charter members. Will, welcome back to the show. Hey, thanks for having me back. I want to get into your piece about how the war in Iran is playing out on the sort of the mega online right and like many potential fractures between Trump and his base. But I guess I'd like to just start with like my observations of the war, at least over the weekend. I'm just going to read here like just a couple examples from this morning. President Trump had this to say on the possibility of the straight-of-form moves closing as oil prices surge. These ships should go through the straight and show some guts. There's nothing to be afraid of. This was echoed by Brian Kilmeade on Fox and Friends this morning where he said, if you wanted to finish the Iranian threat, if you want to make sure this ends with complete around the situation, show some guts and go through that straight. I will. I love that that's that's like what Marge tells Lisa when she gets bullied. Look, just show some guts.

2:03Don't let it don't let it get to you. Show that you're the bigger person. And also I don't think it's giant liquid natural gas canker runs into a mind killing thousands. And also I don't think it's the captains of these ships that really make the decision whether to go through. Like a mind part. Yeah, that's a very like mercantilist view of the world. Yeah, that there's just a bunch of like free roaming captains that are finding liquid natural gas and oil wherever. And I would pair those comments with Lindsey Graham's demands that I saw the other day. Well, Lindsey Graham is essentially demanding that Saudi Arabia commit their military as well to this endeavor. And I guess what I'm saying is it's not exactly an indication that things are going great with the United States is demanding that Saudi Arabia back us up. And like, well, I'm just wondering from your observations, like, are there reasons to believe that Trump himself is already bored of this and or rather disappointed that Iran has not surrendered

3:05so far? Yeah, I mean, I think they were looking for like the Venezuela deal where you sweep in, you have some kind of pliable second-in-command who can take over. And you know, they're not getting that. I mean, you know, Tucker Carlson, for his part, he says, Trump really has no idea how the war is being received. It did strike me how over the weekend Trump said, you know, we have come to a deal with Iran. We're going to pick their new leaders. And then immediately after Iran clearly picked their own leaders. So I don't think, you know, that's working out for him. I love begging Saudi Arabia to join, which is just like, yeah, that's the fucking powerhouse in the region. That's the military. Everyone's afraid of what is like the Trumpest rationale for Lindsey Graham begging for Saudi Arabia to join that, like, they didn't do it earlier because they wanted everyone to be able to grind XP. And otherwise, Saudi Arabia would have just ended the war too quickly. Like they got, when they and the UAE invaded Yemen,

4:06they were getting pushed back into Saudi Arabia. Multiple generals were killed. I don't know, like, how are they going to do against a much better, larger and more well-funded fighting force? People have gone back to this joke a lot. But the, the old thing about the guy who kept feeding stray cats to coyotes more or less. Right. This would be feeding Colombian mercenaries to Iranian. Well, yeah, I just want to say one other thing about the idea of the Saudis joining the fight. There's another story I think I told on the show during our first year of existence. But one of my earliest internet friends was he was an Egyptian guy whose family were in the Egyptian military during the six-day war. And he told me a story that I will never forget. And I definitely told him in 2016 in regards to Saudi military prowess. And he talked about his uncle as being in a fox hole during

5:06that war. And he said that they saw these Saudis roll up with a confoy of trucks. They get into the fox hole. And indeed, in the trucks, in the beds of the trucks were, like, Shaylaunches, cow, canopy beds. And the Egyptians were like, what the fuck are you doing? And the Saudis went, we're joining the fog. We're getting in the fox hole with you. On the Shay's lunch. On the Shay's lunch. On the Shay's lunch. All day long. On the Shay's lunch. To me, I mean, in the demands for Saudi Arabia to get involved, perhaps this was what Marco Rubio was referring to when he made his comments about unleashing Shang the other week. I don't know if you guys caught that. As on this show, as very close observers of the history and career of George H.W. Bush, you may remember that saying that I'm going to unleash Shang was a thing that George H.W. Bush

6:06did during, as part of his tennis game. This was sort of a taunt he did about his serve. But really, what it was referring to was it was him making fun of the insane birchers in the Republican Party who kept demanding of him that they unleashed Shang Kai Shack to refight the Chinese Communist Party and his sort of contempt for that. So Marco Rubio seems to have rebranded it into something that like is a threat rather than an insult to the people who he's talking about. You know the backstory for why Marco says that? No, why? Jeb, so the provenance of earnestly saying unleashed Shang, it actually goes back to the 2016 GOP primary. Jeb was saying this before and during the primary, during a short loath campaign as his like whenever people would ask him about China and Taiwan, of course. And I remember us talking about it on the show then as it was very illustrative of the sort of the degeneration of that party,

7:10how stupid everyone was that this guy's son couldn't understand that this was an ironic joke, much less the fact that the idea of unleashing a guy who previously lost that civil war to fight it again is manifestly hilarious and idiotic. But Jeb, who was close to Marco during his rise, both being fellow Neocons, gave Marco a sword that allegedly belonged to Chang that I don't, I have to believe he got that at a mall. I don't believe he had a sword from Chang, I Shack. But Marco, I think it's in his autobiography or goes written autobiography, says that he received a sword from Jeb, just from a legendary warrior named Chang, who could be like a guy from Mortal Kombat from the way he describes it. It's degenerated so much it's gone from like, we're going to use our proxy who already lost a civil war to fight it again

8:12against a larger and more organized China too. Oh, Jeb, Jeb Bush, my mentor, knew this immortal anti-communist from the Mortal Kombat franchise and I have his sword. It was the sword from a crouching tiger hidden dragon. Yeah. Unleashed Goro. Get over here. Well, you have a piece up called, MAGA already hates Trump's Iran War. It just gets out for us. What are the sort of the battle lines here? Who are the big sort of online right wing pundits and influencers like who is coming out or sort of turning their back on Trump as it regards his invasion or his war against Iran? And like who is sticking with the president? Yeah, I mean, I think on one hand, you know, in terms of the people who are in favor of the war, it's sort of who you'd expect. It's a lot of Fox News people. It's a lot of like hardcore pro-Israel people like Mark Levin and Laura Loomer. But I think the side that's opposed is probably more interesting.

9:13I mean, you've got Tucker who is claiming to, you know, have he flew to the White House several times to sort of beg Trump not to do the war? You've got Candace Owens who claims that, you know, Charlie Kirk was the first victim, you know, first casualty of the war because they killed him to make the war happen. And then, you know, you've got obviously Nick Fuentes. You've got, but maybe most interesting Megan Kelly who sort of goes wherever she thinks things are headed. And so she clearly is like, oh my gosh, I really hate this war. Yeah, she said she had serious doubts on her show last Monday. And then of course, being interviewing Marjorie Taylor Greene, who has like, you know, already left the party, already left politics. But like among people like Tucker, Candace, you know, like you also mentioned the Hodge twins. We all love them. But like, how are they articulating their critique of this war? Or like, or their opposition to it? Well, you know, I think it's not a couple of angles. I mean, certainly someone like Candace Owens, Tucker as well, has said basically, you know, this is the war for, you know,

10:16for Israel that, you know, Trump has basically been duped into this. On the other hand, I think someone like Megan Kelly is just like, what's happening here? You know, like a lot of these people, I think, really want to help Trump. But they, they just aren't getting any help from the administration. Like there's been no effort to explain. It's like they want to be the sort of the stoogeous pushing the war. Like we saw in Iraq. But they just are like, I don't even know what the messaging is supposed to be. So they're like, they want, they realize that they have like not been provided with enough convincing talking points. So they have to sort of freelance it on their own. And they realize that they don't really have much to come up with. Yeah, I mean, they're kind of like the, I don't know, the Saudi Arabia or the Kuwait of the sort of the domestic side where they're like, look, we don't really know what the point is here. We're not going to stick our necks out unless you give us some more. So I mean, certainly, you know, he's someone like Matt Walsh at the daily wire who's like a pretty kind of down the middle regular pro Trump guy. He's saying that, you know, we're being asked to trust the plan. You know, it's like QAnon or that. Or actually, I guess the specific comparison is to like Fauci and saying, you know, obviously for these people, like, you know, we were told to trust the science

11:18and now we're saying, trust Trump. I mean, one thing that's been striking to me is how the argument, I think from the pro-war side, has been like, look, you know, we all hate the forever wars. We hated Iraq. You know, obviously they didn't at the time. But now they're saying, but the difference is Trump is just like really, really a lot more competent. And so people like Pete Hegseth are going to win where Donald Rumsfeld could not. Including comments from Will Chamberlain here. I think it's perfectly indicative of that. He says, quote, here is, the point of being against regime-shames wars was not that regime change is inherently bad, but rather that our political and military leadership couldn't pull it off in an efficient and effective manner. When the facts change, you should change your mind. And I talked about this a little bit last week. But like, the idea here being that like, okay, like regime change was bad because the Trump, sorry, the George W Bush administration was too incompetent to do it correctly. But now they're taking a bite of a much bigger apple that like, you know, a regime change in Iran is considerably exponentially more difficult, you know, than what they managed to do in Iraq.

12:23And as I said, the people in charge of taking this big bite of the apple are already choking on it and don't know, like, we can't even get their story straight about what they are or aren't doing. Yeah, I mean, it's like, it's just crazy, I mean, that the argument is like, we're going to do it right unlike the Bush administration. We got the guy who sent the war plants to Jeffrey Goldberg at the Atlantic. You know, this is the guy who can pull it off. So, I mean, it's really a mess. I mean, I think from a messaging point of view, like we talked about, I mean, I think people like Megan Kelly are pretty willing to get on board for the part where they say, isn't it amazing the power of the American troop? Like, look at that big oil refinery blow up, but they just really don't have any material to do it with. Did you see the, I think this, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee put it out, but it was a Tom Cotton quote about how not only has there been a 47 year imminent war with Iran, which something being imminent for 47 years is just a hilarious concept,

13:26but that Trump is finally ending it. Like that, that seems to be the thing they settled on. Like that it's season nine of a sitcom and he's finally resolving the will they won't be a question. Yeah, the argument is that, you know, oh, we don't want forever wars. Trump is going to be Donald the dove and we're not going to have forever wars. But he's, in fact, by starting this war, he's ending Iran's forever war against us. Yeah, in a sense. In a sense, like, hopefully no one ever fucking tries it again after this disaster. That's like saying the New York Jets have been an imminent threat to win the Super Bowl for the last 47 years. And another tack I've been seeing among, I don't know, like what I would imagine would be like the more hardcore, like dissident, right, pseudo neo Nazi accounts, is it like they seem most willing to continue to back Trump, despite the fact that many of them have explicitly said like we're voting for Trump to prevent a war with Iran.

14:26And like you'll never see boots on the ground. I think they're saying now is like the tack I've been seeing from like a captive dreamer, that's the account I'm talking about, that like he's like, look, we, you know, let's be, let's be mature about this. Like you don't get everything you want in politics. Like maybe this isn't something we all like or like would have voted for, you know, had we known this was going to happen. But like keep the keep your eye on the prize, which is like the mass deportation of every non white person in America. So like Israel gets what they want. America and attack on Iran and like, you know, if we just, if we just keep the faith, we'll get what we want, which is the deportation of like, I don't know, between 50 and 100 million people. Well, the problem with that is like, well, Israel's already gotten what they wanted. But it seems to be like the goal of mass deportations would seem to be further out of reach than it ever has been. And then also, because Trump himself is like already saying we need to chill out with this and like, hey, like there's a lot of good people who work in the agricultural food and hospitality industries that like, you know, really like they're good people.

15:31We shouldn't, you know, let's not get too bent out of shape over it. In that same post, he said, you know, it would be one thing if people were saying, I really like what Trump is doing domestically, but I don't like this. People now want to throw out the whole thing because they don't like the Iran thing, which is just, you know, you better start believing in branded stories because you're fucking in one pal. If you torment Will Stancell for long enough, you will become him. Well, you know, I mean, first captive dreamer. I mean, this is kind of one of the great fail sons of the second Trump administration. I mean, this guy memorably, his dad came out and was like, I hate my racist son. And, you know, he, he had kind of a sexy David Kuresh profile pick. And then it came out. I don't know if you guys see what this guy looks like. Oh, yeah. He's got, he's only got like a cone head essentially, like just like an enormous forehead. And, and I mean, even a lot of people on the right are, are they saying. I mean, you know, I, so some people find having large foreheads. Well, I don't mean to be picking a fight, you know, with on this issue.

16:33So, yeah, I mean, you know, it's interesting that the deportations thing has come up. I mean, on the other hand, someone like Matt Walsh just saying, I think credibly, he's saying, you know, we're told that we can't get mass deportations because it's logistically impossible, which I think, you know, given that they basically tried this in Minneapolis. And it was a huge disaster and they had to pull out. I mean, how are they going to do this across the country? But he's saying, so we're told that's too complicated by the Trump administration. But toppling the Iranian government is something we can do with. Yeah, that's not, you know, that's a very good point by Mr. Walsh. But I guess I'm interested, like, you mentioned, like among the most prominent critics of Trump's war in Iran is Tucker Carlson. I'm like, I'm really wondering, like, how is he, how is he scoring this circle? Because I know he wants to influence the administration. He thinks of himself as close to the administration, but like, didn't Trump just come out the other day and say that he's no longer MAGA and like, he's sort of been kicked out of the movement? And like, Tucker seems to be trying to say that, like, this is all Israel's fault.

17:34And we would have had a perfect Trump second term in office if it wasn't for just Israel making him do this. But like, as she looks brings up over and over again, it's hard to make that argument when Trump was already president for 40 years prior to this. Yeah, I mean, Tucker is clearly all these guys, I think, are really walking along with the exception of Marjorie Taylor Greene, who just comes out and said on Megan Kelley, she's like, what the fuck is going on the president's senile? And so, but everyone else is kind of like, you know, oh my gosh, I sure wish Trump, you know, would stop listening to Benjamin Netanyahu. I mean, in Tucker's case, he tweeted, pray that the spell will pass. You know, I mean, as though the Trump's under the sway of like some kind of warm tongue type figure. It's like, it's not a spell. Like, no spell has been cast, Tucker, you voted for this guy and he won the election. That's not magic. Like, I love that they're having their very own push Trump from push Trump to I don't know the anti intervention is right once he's elected, despite years and years of evidence to the contrary.

18:36But I Brett Cooper, who I put her in a club with that, who's that actor glends something who's in a movie with Sydney Sweeney? Glenn Powell. Glenn Powell. Glenn Powell and Brett Cooper, there are two people who were born in like 1995, but they sound like silent film stars. Like, they sound like they were their names make them sound like they were in a movie with Al Jolson. But I see them and they're younger than me. But Brett Cooper had a thing where she was like, let's pray that Lindsey Graham gets the boyfriend so we can stop going to war. And it's like, that wouldn't be a problem if the guy that you went out of your way to elect twice and attempted to elect three times didn't keep doing this guy's fucking bidding, despite apparently declaring himself to be his mortal enemy and fucking 26. Yeah, you know, I do feel like a lot of people are targeting Lindsey Graham. Megan McCain came out and was just like, they got to stop putting Lindsey out there. He's going crazy.

19:36And it's like, you know, that's your dad's homey, you know, that's your uncle essentially. By the way, I feel like you've run up Brett Cooper and I was just like to use, you just reminded me, I'd like to use this opportunity here too. Bring out the chopper department of corrections on our episode about the Pendragon cycle. I referred to the bull jumping scene depicted in episode one of that show as referencing the Mycenaean culture. That was an error. It was in fact the Minoan culture of the classical antiquity. So sorry, I've docked my pay listener. I punished myself for that grave misapprehension. Employee Spencer will be deprived of food for one month. But will like you sketch that there's like a lot of a lot of high profile mega figures. I've been very critical of Trump on this based on kind of there. I don't know. Sticking to at least their professed values of being like anti interventionism anti regime change. Let's fight the war at home on immigrants and liberals, etc.

20:41But is there any evidence that this is anything other than a kind of media phenomenon? Because it seems like as far as Republican or mega voters as just Republicans go, they seem to be the only group in this country that it seems to be pretty four square supporting the president and this war right now. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to overstate it. I mean, I do think that like, you know, there was that poll last week that said 85% of Trump voters are backing him on this. So, you know, on one hand, yeah, I think that's true. On the other, I think it's still telling that these people who kind of like rely on staying in their audiences good graces. Someone like Megan Kelly, for example, that I think she can see which way it's blowing and saying, geez, you know, what are gas prices going to look like in two weeks? I don't really want to be out here saying, you know, that this war was the greatest thing ever once the one's the warm turns as it were. I mean, I think that they're, you know, and obviously these guys have an impact on public opinion. So, I think if Trump can wrap it up really soon, which seems essentially impossible, I think it'll blow over. But otherwise, I think, you know, he's going to start seeing more and more of kind of like the grassroots people start sounding more like Tucker Carlson.

21:44Well, I mean, just to stay with Tucker Carlson, one of one of my favorite things to observe is like the absolute crusade being waged against. I'm going to use his own nickname for him, Tucker Katarelsen, which is I think I think that's pretty good. Mark Leven and Laura Lumer being like the most pro Israel, the most pro Iran war. They have fixated on Tucker Katarelsen as like the apostate in question that must be excommunicated from MAGA. You know, obviously they're handling, they're handling the evolution of current events with I would say typical and expected calm, even handed this. And you know, speaking, speaking, you know, with a fine even keel to their public comments on this. Yeah, I mean, they're really really going crazy over it. I mean, you know, there's also I should say Tucker has like an evil twin brother or not a twin, I guess evil brother named Buckley.

22:46Buckley is like sort of like disillute Tucker and all he does is fight with Laura Lumer on Twitter all day. And so as a few days ago, but Laura was like, well, she's like after dealing with you Buckley and seeing, you know, Tucker Katarelsen. I can see why your mother abandoned you when you were six years old. She's essentially she's doing the like, you know, people beat up on deadbeat dads. But what if the kid had bad vibes tweet? She's like, you know, I don't blame her your mom for leaving you. I mean, it's getting crazy. I mean, I will say the thing about Tucker, Katarelsen is in this guy, he loves guitar. And it makes you wonder what's going on. I mean, he claimed to have bought an apartment in Qatar. He went to a Qatar conference and came back the next day and said, you know, maybe Qatar should be our number one ally in the Middle East. So there's a lot of influences here and kind of like agendas that play in apartment in Qatar. That's such a weird shit. Like why not? He makes a, I mean, I don't know how much he makes now doing the Tucker Sean acts. But presumably he could get some sort of housing voucher. The apartment just seems like such a weird choice to me. I'm with you.

23:46This sort of word is also is also playing out in Tucker's. He's sort of sponsored nicotine pouch brand called Alps. And they're they're going at Laura Luma through the through Alp promo discount codes. And it was actually the the occluded Carlson, the male brother, Buckley Carlson. It's like get 25% off your outpouches with a promo code Larry Luma. And he see he see he likes to imply that Laura Luma was in fact a born a man and his transitioned into a woman as Laura Luma. That's right. And this is their marketing strategy. I mean, so yeah, so Alp pouches are kind of like there's in knockoff. And Buckley, I don't know if he runs social media for Alp, but it sounds a lot like him. But Buckley's been pushing this idea that Laura was a transgender man or named Larry. And so sort of a Brigitte McCrohn situation. Gordon Kidd also. And so I mean, that's the and then Alp is saying, you know, get a discount on your, you know, your your your your rustic pine Alp by using code Larry Luma.

24:54And now Laura is fighting back and she's going to the FDA, which is reviewing Alp pouches for like I guess it like sort of a permanent release. And they're she's saying, you know, they're stealing my I essentially stealing my identity. They're they're using they're making people think I endorse this product by by saying I'm trans. I like that's their version of like left wing people accusing each other being Democrats. Brigitte McCrohn getting dragged into this, you know, she's a, well, just a password and Laura Luma. What is that was his thing? He was like, he calls her like a medicalist. You know, Laura's other beef with them is that they have posted these Photoshop pictures of her to look worse.

25:54And I will say, you know, Laura's obviously gotten some plastic surgery done repeatedly. I know, I know. So she's she's had a couple kind of different faces. But you know, people love doing the Photoshopped ones and you know, people then say to me, I'm pretty sure that's really her face. And it's like, no, you know, I followed this this saga for a long time. And so in this case, they were indeed posting posting fake ones. And so that's another grievance. I mean, pretty funny of Laura Luma to be like, they're slandering my reputation by knowingly posting false things that are offensive. Yeah. Anyway, here's a three-year-old who's being sent to America because his real blues legs off. He's a terrorist. Yeah, exactly. Just as a state that question, will have you, have you got a chance to sample any of the Alp pouches being offered by Tucker Criteralson? Well, I can't because they hijacked that truck. So no, I have it. I'm not a big pouch guy. Do you guys pack lips? No, I tried to use the Zin once and I found the sensation rather unpleasant. But based on its marketing copy, I think Alp promises even more nicotine than Zin, which is saying a lot.

27:02I used to dip, which is, you know, it shows how much things have changed. When I was a young man, like pouches, you got made fun of for getting pouches. Like pouches were for girls. But at least with dip pouches, you still spit. Like half the point of this is spitting. To take spitting out of the game is just, I don't get it at all. I tried to Zin once. I just really don't like it. I don't think I'll go back to dipping, but I definitely don't enjoy that shit. It just feels so medicinal. Well, you know, they're ramping up the amount of nicotine in Alp. You know, this new brand Alp Drifter has, you know, has I think. Yes, enjoy the smooth nicotine flavor of a man unmoored from family community as he wanders town to town. So John Kisic is like their joke camel from from freight car to rail yard.

28:04Yeah, like when the local sheriff is hassling you for big ones, he just simply pack them out full of high intensity nicotine. The surge in general's warning are just like symbols. It's like a lip with a skull over it. Well, you mentioned the Alp truck hijacking. Did you get into that? Like there was a shipment of Alp that was hijacked. Good fellow style. Yeah, terrible in the Alp community. Yeah, late last month, a new shipment of the new Alp brand Drifter, which promises tropical flavor and way more nicotine. The previous Alp was hijacked using fraudulent credentials. So this wasn't like a gun in the driver's face situation. This was a little more fancy. And so now Alp has had to delay the shipment and Laura Lumer, you know, she could not have been happier. She posted, oh poor Tucker, what a what a poor guy. Yeah, Tucker Carlson is having a bad week.

29:04Gee, what a shame. Maybe look at her. Well, what did she know? So yes, now the Alp wars have started. I'm going to say like of the sort of the pro-Around war, pro-Israel, pro-Trump faction. I really got to say Mark Levin is like my favorite character. He's one of my favorite like regime adjacent fundits because like just just just yesterday. I believe he called Trump the first Jewish president and Trump said he's right. But I love I love Mark Levin's posting style because like, you know, repetition is the key. And like in the weeks leading up to the Iran War kicking off, like you would post over and over again. Kill Khameini now. Kill Khameini now. Kill Khameini now. Another thing killed him and they've replaced him with like his grandson, I think. He's out. Yeah, he's out today and he's going, kill the other one now. Kill the other one now.

30:04Like, how would you describe Mark Levin as like a right wing media figure? Well, I feel like he's the only, you know, he's kind of like maybe like the greatest like just like pure like right wing hawk that we have like left. You know, I think there are a lot of people who wanted this war. I think they've sort of moderated, you know, they don't come out and say just like blow it up. Whereas Mark Levin, I mean, every time I turn into, you know, he calls him, you know, the great one is his nickname. Every time I turn into tune into his show, he's like ranting about some reporter who gave him like a slightly critical remark. I mean, he's just an angry, angry guy. And I think it seems as though even this war hasn't made him happy. He was demanding. I guess there's a House GOP convention in Florida this week. And he's like, they need to expel Tucker and Candace from the movement or we're going to lose the midterms. Like, I got news for you about that. I don't think that's the main issue. That's okay. Like that's one way to salvage the electoral future of the Republican Party coming up.

31:07Because yeah, the polls are not looking good for them right now. I wasn't living on from around like, well, I really did want to talk to you recently about the Candace Owens Erika Kirk, the ongoing saga there. I mean, we mentioned this on the show, but like Candace, like, for all the people who have condemned her, and like, all the people who are like, Candace, no, you've gone too far. Candace, we have to like, excommunicate her. This is crazy. Like, she stays winning. And she has recently come out with like a sort of a new docuseries. Because like, there was a sort of piece of it, a while ago, between her and Erika Kirk, where Candace came out of it. And she seemed to be so much chasing and just being like, hey, like, we're going to work together to salvage Charlie's legacy. That lasted about a second. I don't know.

32:07Because you talk about Candace's new series exposing the real Erika Kirk. It's so good. I mean, that piece summit in early December. I mean, she came out and she's like, all right, Erika sort of, you know, satisfied all my conspiracy theories. We talked about it. There's peace. And two days later, she had this like totally discredited guy who said he had Erika meeting with like military snipers on a military base the day before. So, so the piece did not last long. Oh my god. So the, the, the new docuseries is called bride of Charlie, which is obviously a party. I've got some play on it. That's pretty good. That's not bad. That's not bad. I got to say, I guess a play on bride of Chuckie. Yes. So, so, but you know, and so she's kind of promising like, you know, we're really going to get to the bottom of this, you know, this infamous grifter and deep state operative, Erika Kirk. But all the stuff. I mean, people say this a lot, but like watching one of these episodes, it's like you'll feel like you're having a stroke because she'll, she kind of will rattle something off.

33:07And you're like, okay, okay. And then like 10 minutes later, she's like, what? And what did that have to, you know, what? What is that? That doesn't mean she assassinated her husband. For example, she'll say, you know, Erika's parents, when they got divorced, they listed Erika's birthday is this. But then on her birth certificate, it lists it three days later. Okay. Whoa. I mean, we're through the looking glass here, people. Yeah. That's, I mean, like I, Erika Kirk. I don't, I don't know how it's like still going concern after there is that tape of her going like, all right, y'all, we sure had some fun at my husband's funeral. Great work at the merch table. Oh, yeah, that's right. I'm sad our husband's dead. Who's coming to the after party? But out of anyone who's ever lived, she seems the most likely for her parents to forget her birthday. Like that's just kind of the person in type of person. It doesn't prove anything. I mean, like, will you, you highlighted some of the stoning revelations here that Kayla, this is uncovered about Erika Kirk.

34:10The divorce paperwork for Erika Kirk's parents slightly mistated the year they were married. One of Erika's ancestors was arrested for working for an illegal numbers racket, 85 years ago. Erika Kirk was born. Okay, this is my favorite. Erika Kirk was born in a civilian hospital that was started by the military in the Civil War. This is advanced parapolitics. Yeah. Very good. And Erika Kirk once dressed as a bee in a photo taken of her while she was in daycare. Okay, I understand the implication of like, I understand the implication of being like Erika Kirk was born in a military hospital. The hospital she was born in was founded by the US military in 1864 before, I don't know, just becoming a regular hospital. But what is the implication of her in a, like, sort of cute infant bee costume in preschool?

35:12Well, and making Masonic hand signs at the time. Oh, okay. So here's the deal. So obviously, she's making kind of like a trapezoid with her hands that, you know, Candace Fields is Masonic. But the bee thing is, so in Utah, Mormons are very into bee and honey, comb, you know, bee hive iconography. Because that's kind of how they see their church, it's like everyone's doing their role. So after Charlie Kirk's assassination, Candace kind of casts around and she's like, oh my gosh, there's like a bee in this company's logo where there's a bee in this organization's logo. And so she became convinced that some sort of the freelancer's union, that's a bee hive logo. Exactly. Where were they on the big day? Yeah. You know, so she became convinced that there was like some sort of bee cult that might have been involved in the murder. And then when she saw this bee costume, she was like, oh my gosh, there it is. Okay. Now I'm just like, my third eye is wide open here, Will. Okay. You remember the film Bee Movie? Mm-hmm. About Bee.

36:12About Bee's suing humanity for a cut of the honey they've been taking, created by Jerry Seinfeld, well known Zionist and Jewish person. But like, well, it goes on here like, it does seem to be Candace. Does it seem to be implying that Erica Kirk is Jewish? I think like a lot of the sort of the thrust of this investigation is to like suddenly imply that Erica Kirk is Jewish. So what's the evidence for that? I mean, okay. Can I just say something? Can we leave anti-Semitism to the professional? If you look, if you see Erica Kirk pre-plus exterdry, which I, a lot of people have really gotten bad plus exterdry. Christy Nome being the head of that. I used to love how Christy Nome looked. And now she just look, she looks like they ironed her face. She looks really fucked up. I really don't like what they did. But Erica, Erica had such a cute like Bavarian milk-made nose. I loved her face. And now she has this horrifying like family guy thing.

37:15But in either event, like no Jewish person has ever had Erica Kirk's face. Ever. Ever. If you want to talk about her ancestors, they were a little like, you know, they're family reunions. Everyone looks like Ralph Fines from fucking Schimler's list. There's no way. It's the Scandinavian classic Scandinavian squarehead look. But like, but, but, but this is a real hooplehead. Yeah, yeah. But this is the touch on here. Will, I'm going to read from your piece here. It says, always material actually often turns out to be quite bland. She spends a chunk of the first episode of bride of Charlie focusing on whether Erica Kirk, whose family is father's family is Swedish, has been using the Swedish word more far mother's father when she should be using the word far far father's father to describe her paternal grandfather in Instagram posts. You write a normal person might say to this, who gives a fuck? If you owe and this is serious stuff, the more far far far scandal troubles me deeply, Owen said apparently not ingest.

38:23It's crazy. The scandal. We all know this big scandal. I mean, at one point she's like, this doesn't make any sense because the grandfather would have corrected her. He said, no, no, no, I'm your far far. Well, the post she's citing is about her grandfather dying. So he wouldn't have been around to say, hey, I saw you posted on IG. Well, it's her first assassination. But also the like, Candace's former collaborators at the daily wire like Ben Shapiro. I mean, like, look, they hired her, then they fired her. But like, you know, Ben Shapiro says now that like, you know, what, what Candace is doing to Erica Kirk is quote, Satanic. You know, like, I, leaving aside my personal distaste for all of these people. I mean, it's like, yeah, like if your friend got murdered and then like one of your ex friends dedicated their entire life to attacking the widow of the person that was murdered, that would be like, you know, that's, that's a, that's pretty low.

39:28But that being said, like, they don't seem to be, they don't seem to have had much success in sort of disciplining their own audience or Candace's audience. Or like the, the pool of right wing media consumers to like stay away from this or that it's all crazy or that you shouldn't be platforming this or you shouldn't be listening to Candace because like, it seems like with all these things like when the sort of the headmaster that manages you like not to consume certain media or this is dangerous or a cookie conspiracy theory, that's like ringing the ringing the dinner bell to these people like what do you, what do you, what do you make of their sort of increasingly desperate attempts to try to like head Candace office of the past before she keeps coming out with more more damning far far with scandal material. I think like over ever since Trump really got on the scene and even before that, the right has really lost the ability to sort of like police what their audience believes, you know, as long as it doesn't like the craziest thing. I mean, they, you can see there, I mean, Ben Shapiro, someone who profited from having Candace in his company.

40:29I mean, this was after she made kind of some pro Hitler remarks that he brought her in. And now he's saying, you know, okay, but like this one time, you know, you can't really believe. You know, for people on the right, that's max of cancel culture. You know, we saw this at the turning point convention in December where Ben Shapiro gets up and sort of points out what you said, which is like this is pretty twisted. This guy was like executed in front of the whole world. And now we're dragging his widow around and saying she murdered him and all this stuff. And then Russell brand gets up and he goes, hey, I don't want to do, oh, I don't want to do any cancel culture here. And, you know, so there were a lot of people who got up and did that same thing where they were, they were saying, you know, I think we can have both Ben Shapiro and Candace in the same party. Which is, you know, I don't think it's really tenable. And I think the view counts certainly show who's winning. I mean, Ben Shapiro's are growing down all his commenters are saying, you know, he sold out to cover up the Charlie Kirk murder and you know, Candace is thriving. Well, it reminds me of how, you know, I think this is part of a broader schism and a broader self contradiction and then a broader coalition.

41:31Which is, okay, we can issue hateful and effective against everyone against all types of immigrants against black people against Latinos. We can say that Haitians reading cats and dogs. But don't ever say anything about Israelis, nothing about Jews. And we can keep those things separated forever. Yeah, like, how, like, how can you do this thing where it's like, oh, yeah, Tim Waltz killed that those like hapless fucking Minnesota state legislators. Like, I don't buy that insane guy. But like, how dare you, how dare you talk about Erica Kirk, who she, like, there aren't even that many sparklers on her funeral suit. Yeah, I mean, that's not that festive of a costume. And we're seeing this kind of this sense among, you know what? And I use it slightly like sort of like the intellectuals of the right are getting sort of disgusted with their audience. And so, you know, we've seen this in some cases with Richard Hanaya, who's like, become a totally like weird kind of like lib-goated guy. Because he's just like, I'm sick of these idiots.

42:31But also, you know, I think more importantly, people like James Lindsay, conceptual James, Chris Rufo. Chris Rufo, yeah. Because you would be the most like the most sterling example of someone who, you know, like the right wing intellectuals, the book readers on the right. Like, they betray the absolute contempt they have for their audience because they're like, oh, I can program these dumb domes by saying that Haitians are eating people's cats. And then when called on it, I'll say, well, it's an issue and it's a way to get people to talk about it. But then like when you feed an audience of like non-stop bigotry and conspiracy theories, then when someone else programs them with things that you find distasteful or are getting out of hand, you're like, hey, it's getting too far now. And like, you know, they're kind of this anti-intellectualism and conspiracy mongering has become a big issue only because nobody's fucking listening to Chris Rufo anymore. Well, you, I mean, you know, give me another example, Tyler Olivera, who's one of these YouTube, you know, Nick Shirley types who kind of bangs around towns.

43:31He pushed a lot of the Haitian eating dog stuff. Then obviously you have Nick Shirley saying, you know, some all these are these welfare sponges. Then this Tyler guy goes to New Jersey and looks at the Orthodox Jews and he says, you know, they're pulling welfare scams too. And suddenly everyone like Chris Rufo is saying, whoa, hold up, hold up. You know, people have been promoting these earlier things. I mean, we talked about this on the show before, but like, it seems like a big debate in the right is like whether you can have a political movement largely based on outright open hostility to every minority group. And the question is whether you can include or not include Jewish people in the like, you know, like, are they in the club or out? And it's just like how like if your politics is going to be like outright like ethnic nationalism. And what case in history has that ever been like fomented in which Jewish people were not always, always become the target of the, you know, as an out group to this kind of like, you know, like I said, like, ethno nationalist politics.

44:34It seems like, you know, people like Chris Rufo, like, and the people met at Tyler Olivera. They're like, oh, wait, wait, hold on a second. We didn't mean Jewish people. We just meant Asians, Black people, Muslims, Arabs, like, you know, like Asians, South Asians, eats Asians, Latinos, Central Americans. But we did not mean Jewish people like guys. This has gotten crazy. This is out of hand now. No, it's crazy. I mean, they fed into all of it. And now they're saying, you know, like, you know, you guys have crossed over a line here. To that end, there wasn't, there was a story that came out over the weekend about yet another one of these sort of group chats getting leaked. And now this one involved members of the Florida State GOP. And like, the name of the chat was gooning in a gartha. And that is where the humorous aspects of this story ceases.

45:34Because the contents of this chat were just basically nonstop poisonous racism of, you know, imagine it in your head. That's what they were saying. I mean, like, calling Black people the inward, calling for nonstop death and torture of Black people. Well, like, this is like the third or fourth one of these stories. Like, how does the, how does the Florida GOP were like, what has there been response to this? And like, what does this say broader about basically young Republicans in America today? And as I think you hinted at, like, all of these people were Hispanic needless to say. And so they're, I mean, I think what it says is, is, you know, something that's been talked about, gosh, going back to Charlottesville, Alex Perine wrote about this at the time. But that, like, the energy on the right that's attracting young people to be like professional Republicans is, I think, for the vast majority of them, this kind of racist stuff. This was great barism, this anti-Semitism. And that's why we keep seeing these group chats leak where, you know, privately, they're just insanely racist.

46:35You know, the Rick Scott, the Senator from Florida, Florida Republican Party came out and said, oh, you know, this is awful. But you know, obviously, these people didn't care when Nick Fuentes was dining with Trump at Mar-a-Lago. I mean, all these other instances we could point to. So I think there's the sense of like, sorry, kids, you blew up your spot. You got to go. You made it too explicit. But I don't think there's really like truly like deep concern about this. One of the chats was titled Uber retards Yapping Incorporated. And like, you know, I mean, this is something like, you know, that we've talked about on the show, and I know you've covered. But like, it's the sense of like, it's nihilism. And like, it's like, guys in irony or like, you can make it seem so absurd. It sort of inoculates you from like, the fact that like, you're giving yourself permission to just really let this kind of violent hatred out of you. And like expressing it in this kind of like meme language, like, gooning in a gartha. I guess that's my question. Like, explain to our listeners who maybe aren't familiar with it.

47:37What a gartha is. And like, how did the sort of conspiracy theory or I don't know, whatever mythical concept of a gartha becomes such a thing on the kind of neo-nazzi right when I notice we don't need an explanation of what gooning is. Sounds good. A gartha is kind of this idea of like a sort of like, Nazi heaven, like maybe in the mountains. It's kind of like what the Nazis in, in like Indiana Jones, like the occult Nazis might have been looking for. And I think there are a lot of tip-tock memes about like a gartha, this kind of like mountain readout for for all white people. I've seen a lot of ones of like Jeffrey Epstein escorting Charlie Kirk's like ghost to a gartha and like living there with Hitler, but like, no, no, I don't mean to correct you well, but like, I mean, I could be wrong. I always thought a gartha was the hollow earth. It was like the kind of like paradise at the center of the earth, which is the hollow earth theory.

48:39Part of it though, what? It's part of like a cobbled together like SS, a cult mythology, right? Yeah, then it involves a hollow earth. I would defer to you on this. Here's N.O.I. stuff in there. I mean, people, you know, Gakub is a timeless character. I can't wait till he's in the public domain. Oh, you know, a gartha could be a lot of places, but but but hollow earth sounds unbelievable to me. That reminds me Miles Davis had an album named the gartha known hyperborean miles David. But this is also like, it's just something very specifically Florida about this, like, you know, these are all like right wing Miami Cubans who, you know, as you mentioned, or, I don't know, by various criteria of racial categorization, like white, not white. And how they see themselves, but like, there does seem to be like, I saw a poll today. This was done by the Manhattan Institute, which is like, you know, a right wing thing.

49:42And according to their polling, 54% of Republicans under the age of 50 believe that the Holocaust was in some way fraudulent, either exaggerated or did not happen at all or was, you know, like. The historians have been lying about it and among, among breaking down by demographics among young Republicans who most believe it. It is in fact Latino and black Republicans who believe that the Holocaust is fake more than young white Republicans, but like still overall. Republicans under 50, according to the Manhattan Institute, if you want to take them seriously, believe that the Holocaust didn't happen. Yeah, it's crazy. I mean, I, I think there's a lot of, you know, there's a lot of these figures. I mean, obviously Nick Fuentes, most prominently, I mean, I think even if they aren't coming out and say, you know, the Holocaust is fake, there's a lot of people who are saying, you know, the, you know, the logistics don't make sense. I mean, Nick Fuentes was famously saying, you know, cookie monster, you know, cook six million cookies at once or whatever. I mean, so, so yeah, right? I mean, so, you know, and in fact, you know, to your point about, you know, black and Latino Republicans dating podcaster Myron Gaines, whose name is, of course, because you're admiring his gains in the gym.

50:52He was, you know, he got it up. Former DHS agent. Yes, former DHS agent, make of that what you will. You know, he was kicked out of the TPUSA convention for wearing one of these cookie monster shirts. So I think, yeah, I mean, as I think this chat would suggest as well. I think this is like pretty widespread. Well, it's a terrible new meaning to the term Latino tweets. Latina tweets. I'm sorry. But it does seem to be that like, there seems to be an emerging sort of multi-racial neo-Nazi coalition, like kind of coalescing on the right. Yeah, no, it's that's real. And on the surface, it is obviously very strange and like contradictory. Like, I think like if you think, if you, I don't know, roll it around in your head. Like it does make a certain sense in terms of like who gets in and out of the club. And if you want to be in the club, the way to like, you know, your, your sort of, I don't know, entrance to the VIP section is how willing you are to, I don't know, go full Nazi.

51:53Or like, how willing you are to attack the, like, you know, attack and to humanize the other out groups, which include most white people in this country, ironically. Oh, yeah, I mean, we're actually married to Americans. Yeah. If we want to use that term. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, look, I mean, we're talking a few days after Enrique Terrio, the head of the proud boys, who I think is Black Latino, was, you know, hugging Marco Rubio at the meeting of the, the shield of the Americas, which, you know, the fact that Enrique Terrio is involved is kind of giving like, like Operation Condor vibes. You know, these kind of like, these sort of like would be fascist figures. So I do think that, you know, this, this kind of like Latino, you know, the Black, like far right groups are, I mean, you know, I was just talking about Mairen gains as well. Yeah. Yeah. I, I saw this up and had an institute to pull to and I was like, I guess slightly skeptical in how you reconcile it with like this overwhelming support for Israel and intervention in Iran among the GOP. But then I saw, and again, you know, this is extremely anecdotal.

52:55But I saw a great screenshot of like a Republican guy arguing with like, you know, just some random guy on Twitter. And they're arguing about Iran. And this guy said, you know, the guy was arguing with said, he tried to make a point using the Holocaust as an example, and the guy's reputation was one, the Holocaust literally didn't happen. Two. Well, what about October 7th? Oh my god. I guess there is like, there is like some room to be like, yeah, a guy who, a guy who thinks the Holocaust didn't happen. But also like, we need to make these Ivy leagues like less anti-Semitic and go to war with Iraq. I, you know, if there is one thing that is true about America and especially right-wing movements in America, it takes all kinds. It really does. I guess, I mean, I guess it shouldn't be too surprising because like, whether it's, you know, Jewish state or not, like, if you are a fascist and like, you're, you know, your dream for the world is more or less unrestrained war all the time against everyone.

54:04I mean, like, you know, there's a lot to admire in the conduct of the Israeli state. I mean, you know, not for nothing. It's not like Israel is, or Israeli society for that matter is really that well known for its great conduct and treatment of Holocaust victims. This is a pretty fucking nasty sling term for them over there. Well, moving on to another bit of domestic political news. The outster of Christi Nome from the Department of Homeland Security. Christi Nome is out and Mark Wayne Mullin is in. And I wish I got to say, that's two first names. Like, well, what are you doing? Mark Wayne, pick one. But, but will, what, what, what was the, like, have you been following this? Like, what, what led to Christi Nome's out there? Because like, obviously like Minneapolis could not have gone worse for them. But like, it was, it was like sort of a combination of that and this like ludicrous corruption that's just been,

55:05being come to, come to the fore as a way. Yeah, I mean, I think the real issue for her was not like the corruption, but that she sort of said Trump had given her permission to be corrupt where she said, you know, Trump approved in her Senate hearing. They were asking her about this $200 million ad campaign about her riding on horseback. And they said, well, like, why did this happen? And she said, well, look, Trump approved it. And you know, whether that's true or not, it sort of seems like Trump is like, look, you can kind of do your griff, but don't put me on the hook for it. I have my own griff's going on. Yeah. And that kind of, and also like, I feel like the talk about her affair with Corey Lewandowski. This alleged affair was just becoming like so crazy, like with her husband in the room, when she's getting asked about it. And you know, I think she got the boot for that reason. I wouldn't say I felt bad for her, but I did like, I put myself in her boots for a second, where that hearing where the guy was like pointed out that Corey Lewandowski was drunk and got into a fist fight on the plane over like her blanket or something. And her husband is in the robe behind her looking like Michael Douglas in falling down.

56:09Like, no one has ever clenched his jaw harder. He needs an entire new set of molars. Imagine like that happens. And then it's like, you immediately have to go home. You can't even be like, oh, I'm like, did they need me at like the border? You can't go. Oh, I'll just give this a few days to cool down this horrible public humiliation of my family and my husband. You just, you immediately have to go home and like sit in silence while you both watch Landman. But I want to go back to the, the, the ad that, that a lot of this, a lot of the controversy, so Chrissy Nome cut an ad like for herself and the Department of Homeland Security that involved her riding on horseback. This was like a political ad. I don't even know how long it was, but the budget was $200 million. What is she making Avatar? Like, what? How did she spend $200 million on that?

57:09Well, that's what's so crazy about it. I mean, like pro public has done some reporting on this. I mean, it's sort of inexplicable. I mean, I think it was this whole ad campaign. Part of it was her riding on the horse. Her, her, her, her one of her cronies husband was the horse Pegasus. I mean, it's really, it's crazy. I mean, you know, the amount of waste there. I mean, the Washington Examiner just had this story about how they bought all of these like cool DHS and ice branded SUVs. But the issue is as we've learned him in theapolis, these guys can't drive around and branded SUVs. Like, they have to, they have to be unmarried. And so basically they ordered like millions of dollars worth of these cars. And now they're saying, well, these are totally useless. We've been drawing a lot of equivalents to like, you know, the, the sickening of Europe end of the Ottoman Empire era of woke one. And Trump too. Isn't it so appropriate that the version of the internals for Trump to an anti-woke one is the Christy dome DHS commercial?

58:09Like that's her first male non-Johnny like shortening his life by 50%. It's spending like, they probably like went over a budget by the same ratio. It's Kingo. Kingo's right. That's so all my favorite guys. Well, they both kind of went through like a dramatic, you know, image transformation, body transformation, expecting this big franchise. You know, I'm going to be in the public eye for a long time now. Yeah, it says a misnome said Mr. Trump had tasked her with getting the message out to the country. As the Mr. Trump had signed off on the campaign before the ads aired, misnome responded, we had that conversation. Yes, before I was put into position and sworn in and confirmed and since then as well. And it's also the idea of like getting the message out. I mean, like, what did she think that meant? Your head of DHS. The message of like Christy dobs existence. Yeah. The message of you that you can ride a horse and like through some like sort of splendid vista in South Dakota.

59:13But like, you would think getting the message out as headed DHS would be like, I don't know, hosting a press conference. Like why the need for this ad? Like it's just advertising that DHS exists and she's in charge of it. I think one of the ads were supposed to be sort of saying like, hey, you better self-deport. Like we're coming for you, you know, on my horse. You know, I mean, the spending, I mean, you know, we didn't talk about the, they bought the jet for her and Corey Lewandowski to travel on that. They had like a bedroom. They had a bedroom, private bedroom in the private jet. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, why don't they just use the jet that a Qatar gave Donald Trump? Well, what happened to Doug? What happened to the department of Doug? Where are they? Where are they? Imagine what she told the husband. Like why is there a fucking bedroom on the jet that's for you and Corey Lewandowski? Oh, he has dark ellipsy. Oh, my God.

1:00:13Look, Corey Lewandowski. Um, Christy knows husband. Christy knows for that matter. Check out the inner pole song mind over time. It's about this exact situation. I think it will get you all through this. And it wasn't just, it wasn't just the jet or the $200 million campaign add either because like when she was testifying recently right before her ouster. There was this other like another $143 million government contract that was given to a company that did not exist eight days before the contract was granted to them. And does not have an address associated with the company. And the only person like on the legal documents is someone who worked for Christy know when she was governor of South Dakota. Yeah. I mean, it's crazy. And you know, it's crazy to do with this. You have to remember when Christy know took over DHS. She made a rule that every expenditure over $100,000 had to be personally approved by her for for those related reasons. So you have like the Texas flood and they couldn't get people out there for for repair repair operation.

1:01:17Yeah, because they were pinching pennies about like how many sandbags they could fucking buy exactly. And then then they're just like blowing all this money on all these crazy ad campaigns. I mean, like clearly though, Christy know I'm thought I think this was like a like a campaign add for her in 2028, right? Like I think this is very clearly like her spending $200 million to establish a national brand for herself, you know, in anticipation of a presidential run. Because you know, I mean like why why also any politician be filmed on horseback if not to run for president. Yeah, totally. I mean, look, I mean, I feel like a lot of the cabinet, you know, members are getting ready. I mean, RFK juniors certainly, you know, and so, you know, and he's he's he wants he's going to run for president again. I think so. Oh my god. Oh my god, more of that. The Daily Mail just had a story about his sexual magnetism. So it's it's sort of like, I mean, you know, you can you can scoff at that. But like, I mean, the proof is in the pudding.

1:02:17I mean, he's like, he's ruined a lot of lives because of that magnetism. Listen, access of resistance. We love your work. We hope you love arts. The head of America, our most important guy. His name is Robert F. Kennedy juniors. Like, you know, RFK juniors, like, I mean, I mean, I was just like Rubio and JD Vance. I've got to be like, those two have got to be the front runners at this point, right? Yeah, I would say so. But you know, at the same time, like, I feel like there's, you know, there's a lot of talk about, you know, advanced. Does he have what it takes? Famously, clavicular said Newsom would maw him. So, you know, there's all kinds of real concern. He's facing. I guess finally, since you brought him up, like, how are things going in the mog wars? You know, it's interesting. I feel like we haven't heard from old clavicular in a little bit. I mean, he's definitely kind of bobbing around out there. He had his big, you know, trip to New York a few weeks ago, where he hung out with the dime square people and like the Peter T.O.

1:03:21Lights. And, you know, I watched a bit of that live stream. It was pretty grim. You know, it was like a lot of kind of like rich guys coming up and being like, hey, clavicular, like coming out with us. And he was just like, he was just like, we got to get away from these forwards. Who is the guy who had his wig taken off on the live stream? Androgenic. Androgenic. Yes. But actually, like, that androgenic guy, like, I mean, some of these maw guys, they'll like flip out on people. It's crazy. I mean, clavicular is definitely the most level headed of them. And he ran a guy over in a cyber truck. But like, you know, like, there have been points where like some girl will just like kind of look at him at the club and be like, you suck to like androgenic. And he'll be like, yo, like, just screaming. That that androgenic, um, the thing with his hack and extend that seems like a bit to me. I don't know. I mean, to me, a lot of that stuff, it just seems like it's like even goofier pro wrestling. It seems like they're in on it. Yeah. If you know, I mean, well, you would know better than I would. But that seems to be my read of it as a, um, I think at this point, I mean, an internet veteran.

1:04:25We're getting away from the real honest maw gang. And, and I think it's getting into this. But you're, you're totally right. I mean, definitely like the second wig snatch was fake. Um, you know, the like back, we got to go back to when clavicular was a bouncer. And I on in Cape Cod taking like huge amounts of muscle relaxants just to talk to a girl. I mean, that's like the real, the real looks maxing culture. Oh my, wait, he was about, oh my god, he's like my, uh, warrior. We're on his. I don't know. That's a similar trajectory. Yeah. I don't know. Like, when, when I see this, it's like, it's updates from like one of the, one of the streaming platforms. Like, I think it's kick. And whenever I just see like, it's, it's constant updates that come across my Twitter stream. And they're like, they're like dispatches from like some, some sort of loony tunes version of the Wild West, where it's just like the bogged power ranking. So they're like, hey, as you frat leader has just been demogged by like, you know, a gorilla Chad. I mean, it's just, I mean, compared to the other, do you know what the other stuff on kick is?

1:05:29The other stuff on kick is like, there's this like 62 year old former Pimp named Mr. Based, who just exploits an autistic guy and like attempts to assault girls on camera. Like, there are guys who are just like committing statutory like on stream. Like kick is one of kick is like a live streaming service that would be on SVU in 2011. Like, it is, I mean, Don Craykin would contend with. It is one of the darkest fucking places on the internet. It would really test my free speech absolutism. If I were president, I would immediately strike it down. But like, what those guys are doing is so much more innocent and okay compared to what everyone else is fucking doing. Which like, if it is not just like rampant sex crimes, it's trying to encourage 11 year olds to steal their parents' credit cards and gamble. Yeah, when you said sitting your face with a hammer. I was like, this is cool.

1:06:29He was a, he was a pretty well known guy in the early 2010s. He was, he claims to have invented the girlfriend experience. Wait a second. Wait a second. I thought girlfriends invented that. I did too. Yeah, no, his name is God, I had sang this Mr. based. I don't know, like, whatever I see it, it just seems to be like sort of a live sort of participatory nationwide harmony Korean film of which we're all involved in. And at any moment, you could find yourself a part, a part of like spring breakers part two featuring as you frat leader, Android Genic and like just a cast of, a cast of wonderful, wonderful freaks and grotesques. Maybe it's because when I was their age, when I was, you know, when I was like a 22 year old bouncer, I would do things like, I hope he's listening.

1:07:33My friend, Dirty Mike, Dirty Mike, I hope you're doing well. When we, we were helping him train for his first amateur boxing match. We found this weird Chinese peptide from a research chemical website. You could, that was still in the surface web because this is like 2012, 2013. And you would take it via oral syringe and it would help you cut weight while retaining muscle. But the side effect was that it made you nearly blind during the night, which was in retrospect. My job of working at a barcle, it's not good for that. But it really, my com gutters were reasonably sharp. So I think I, I just like instinctively defend these guys because I know where they're coming from. And at least compared to like the other guys on kick, I just, I think like hitting yourself in a hammer, fucking shooting yourself up with all these chemicals. Listen, I don't recommend people do it. But when you're 22, that, that like you are very resilient.

1:08:36I don't suggest that you make yourself in fertile. I didn't do that. But like, hey, shit, it's been a lot of other stuff I see on that website. I wouldn't say I support all these guys decisions, but I am a, um, it could be worse is my point of view. All the kids from gumbo have grown up and are on research chemicals and they look fantastic. They're magging everyone. They've gotten out of the bathtub and they're on the streets. Mog frame. I was it each other. I was an early mager. I was magging in the ages in the age of like maroon pants in American apparel. I remember I, I didn't know if the research chemical was working until one time at work. Uh, these, these two girls got into an argument and, uh, they were explaining what was going on to another bouncer. And they said, yeah, and then this and they looked at me and went, this skinny white boy came over and I went. Me? Are you talking about me?

1:09:37Totally forgot what was going on. But yeah, no, I mean, it's young men will always do it. Young men will always, um, get chemicals that should not be ingested for their cum gutters. Are you referring to me, man? Me, madame. Are you referring to me? Let's leave it there for today. Uh, Will Somer. I want to thank, uh, thank you for joining us today. Please check out Will's work over at the bulwark and we will include links in the episode description. Yeah. Thanks for having me on. Uh, well, I'll, I'll, I'll catch you up at the next council of the Will's meeting. Of course. All right, everybody. Till next time. Bye-bye. Bye.